Don't have an account? Create one!

Homosexual Rights.

AuthorMessage
Mindfuck
Always Born a Crime
Mindfuck
Age: -
Gender: Female
Posts: 5614
May 26th, 2009 at 08:32pm
^I don't like prop 8, but was it illegal as you stated? I don't think it was illegal; it just reeks of injustice.
questionable content
Always Born a Crime
questionable content
Age: 28
Gender: Female
Posts: 5604
May 26th, 2009 at 09:14pm
I think it is illegal (and banning homosexual marriages in general) because I see that as discrimination.
Now many people would disagree with me there, but some don't, like the court in my home state of Massachusetts, which ruled that the gay marriage ban was unconstitutional for that same reason.
Person0001
Always Born a Crime
Person0001
Age: 43
Gender: Female
Posts: 5099
May 27th, 2009 at 11:05am
questionable content:
California is among the first states to legalize gay marriage, but it is also the one that has most recently banned it as well.
I think Prop 8 is a disgrace and I'm disgusted with us being the only democracy on the planet that simultaneously embraces Conservativism. I have to correct you, however: California has never legalized gay marriage. The only states to have done so thus far are: New Hampshire, Connecticut, Iowa, Maine, Massachusetts and Vermont. New York is currently trying to push a bill through the Senate for votes.
Spirit of Jazz.
Motor Baby
Spirit of Jazz.
Age: 103
Gender: Female
Posts: 918
May 27th, 2009 at 01:33pm
^ I think Michigan is working on one as well... That's what I've heard, anyways.

I don't understand why it's banned in so many states. If the U.S. is supposed to have a separation of church and state, than why didn't this get solved 200 years ago? If we can't say the word 'God' in the pledge of allegiance in public schools, then... why is gay marriage not allowed? The book of the bible (bear with me here) that supposedly is against everything that could possibly be gay, also says 'Do not judge one another' and 'love every man equally'... So, doesn't that kind of void the other part? Flip anywhere in the bible (or most major religions, i'm pretty sure they all have this written somewhere)... it'll say 'don't judge people', 'love your neighbor', etc... Are we supposed to just ignore these and forget about them? In my experience, the people who are made fun of (i.e, gay people, 'goth' kids) are the nicest people on earth, and the people who make fun of those people are often the ones with some serious issues. My theory is that they only hate the gay people because they don't know anything else, or, they just have big self esteem problems so they take that and project it at everyone. Think about it. Who's usually nicer? The stick-thin cheerleader who works at Aeropostale, or the gay 'goth freak' hot topic employee with tattoos everywhere? The people who torment others are usually pretty tormented themselves. These are the ones who consider themselves religious, and then turn around and... judge other people. I realize that hypocrisy is never going to go away, it's part of human nature, as is religion (the opiate of the people- thanks, karl marx) but if we in the united states preach to not judge people, why be so half-assed about it... it just doesn't make sense. I guess that's also human nature: stupidity. We're one of the most advanced nations in the world, but also very very stubborn. We hate change. (which is ironic- our president's slogan revolves around change) If we weren't so opposed to everything, we'd be using the metric system, maybe we wouldn't be so damn fat, and gay marrige would be legal. Deb's right. We're one of the few nations that reject gay marriage, we need to fix something soon.

...Just my opinions... no need to attack me....
questionable content
Always Born a Crime
questionable content
Age: 28
Gender: Female
Posts: 5604
May 27th, 2009 at 03:10pm
Deb, I'm pretty sure California has legalized same-sex marriage, otherwise, how would thousands of gay couples have been able to marry in California?.

Separation of church and state doesn't mean that legislators and voters cannot use their religious beliefs to guide them when voting and passing laws. So, if someone is raised thinking that homosexuality is morally wrong, and therefore so is gay marriage, then they can and will vote against it. And yes, it is hypocritical, but perhaps it does go with the "love the sinner but not the sin" thought. As an atheist, I don't believe in many of the things the Christian Bible (or any other holy book, for that matter) say, but many people do, and use it as a moral guide--I don't think it's right for anyone to attack them for it either, after all, it's their opinion, just like ours here. I think it goes beyond personal problems, to the way they were raised. I read this on a website somewhere, to paraphrase, the person said "if gay marriage is legalized, one of the things that people have always believed (that homosexuality is immoral) will be torn down, and if that is, what else can be?" I think this is very true and it explains part of why generally, younger people are more likely to support it than older, and non-religious more than religious.
Humans as a whole have a tendency to resist change. I don't think it can really be helped, but misunderstanding is definitely a part of it--on all sides of every issue.
We're actually in good company among nations that reject gay marriage. In many countries, Muslim and poorer ones, in general, homosexuality--not just marriage-- is illegal, and is sometimes punishable by death. But most Western nations have embraced homosexuals, if not in their culture than at least in their laws.
Mindfuck
Always Born a Crime
Mindfuck
Age: -
Gender: Female
Posts: 5614
May 28th, 2009 at 02:38am
Deb:
I think Prop 8 is a disgrace and I'm disgusted with us being the only democracy on the planet that simultaneously embraces Conservativism. I have to correct you, however: California has never legalized gay marriage. The only states to have done so thus far are: New Hampshire, Connecticut, Iowa, Maine, Massachusetts and Vermont. New York is currently trying to push a bill through the Senate for votes.
California did actually legalise gay marriage last year. According to this wiki article, "California became the second U.S. state, after Massachusetts, to make marriage licenses available to same-sex couples". Thousands of gay couples wed in state of California.

Has anyone seen this video? It was made a while ago, but it's quite touching I think. It was basically a campaign video made by people trying to stop Prop 8 from divorcing the gay couples who wed during the time it was legal.
Person0001
Always Born a Crime
Person0001
Age: 43
Gender: Female
Posts: 5099
May 28th, 2009 at 09:11am
Mindfuck:
According to this wiki article, "California became the second U.S. state, after Massachusetts, to make marriage licenses available to same-sex couples".
Odd, because it's never been listed among the six states that have gay marriage legalized. I remember distinctly friends of mine who live there lobbying to get Arnold to put up a bill. Apparently Prop 8 won't illegalize any marriages performed before it passed. I can't decide if I agree with that or not, because it's discriminatory still.
ennui.
Awake and Unafraid
ennui.
Age: 31
Gender: Female
Posts: 11393
May 28th, 2009 at 09:14am
KAT0123:
For example, there are some religions out there that allow marriage to multiple partners. It wouldn't be fair for the gov't to only recognize marriage between 2 ppl (gay or straight) when all 8 ppl are sincerely in love with e/o and want to be married as a group. Even though many of us would say, "no way...that's wrong," wouldn't that be depriving them of their rights?

But the majority of polygamous marriages exploit women, therefore it's seen as 'wrong'.


questionable content
Always Born a Crime
questionable content
Age: 28
Gender: Female
Posts: 5604
May 28th, 2009 at 02:49pm
^ If you put it that way, it seems a lot like marriage between a child and an adult, where the child is frequently exploited. However, grown women aren't children, they're consenting adults. (if they do not consent, that's a forced marriage and illegal regardless if polygamy is legalized or not).
Person0001
Always Born a Crime
Person0001
Age: 43
Gender: Female
Posts: 5099
May 28th, 2009 at 03:27pm
I think the point here is that it's completely hypocritical for the Religious Right to use the "one man, one woman" argument against gay marriage but not against polygamy.
questionable content
Always Born a Crime
questionable content
Age: 28
Gender: Female
Posts: 5604
May 28th, 2009 at 03:56pm
^
Polygamy is more frowned upon (in the US, at least) than homosexuality, so I think they're focusing more of their attention on that rather than polygamy, so that's why you don't hear it as much. I'm sure that argument is still used against polygamy.
LunacyFringe
Killjoy
LunacyFringe
Age: 30
Gender: Female
Posts: 82
May 28th, 2009 at 08:10pm
I cant really say I have a die hard opinion on homosexual rights.

If your looking from a constitutional standpoint then homosexuals definitely should have the right to marry. The constitution is clear on all of us having the natural right to happiness, and if being gay makes you happy, then the government shouldnt be able to tell you that your happiness is less important then the happiness of a heterosexual couple.

But then there are those who, while we must abide by the laws and constitution of our country, we still answer to higher laws (and when I say higher I mean that for us personally they are more important), which would be the laws of God and the Bible.

So if my only accountability was to my country, then I would say homosexual marriage should be a definite go, but because the laws of my God are much more important to me, and because I believe God's laws are to come before the laws of man, I am surely torn.

I oppose homosexual marriage simply because I believe it to be against the laws of my God. But then I also dont feel I have the right to force this belief on the lifestyles of others. But then I also believe that I need to fight to keep marriage the sacred bond that my God created it to be. But at the same time I dont think I have the authority to control others, and I shouldnt have that authority.

So i guess im against homosexual marriage, but im not someone who is fighting to make sure that it stays illegal either Rolling Eyes
John St. John
Shotgun Sinner
John St. John
Age: 31
Gender: Male
Posts: 7145
May 28th, 2009 at 08:31pm
Quote
But the majority of polygamous marriages exploit women, therefore it's seen as 'wrong'.


I disagree, how do they exploit women when in many of these relationships women know the cirumtances and can walk out at any time , granted not all of them but you can't tar them all with the same brush. Also relationships like this arn't limited to one man with many wives, itcan be one wife with many husbands or many wives and husbands, although according to wiki pedia this is called
polyandry or just group marriage. I know I've gone off topic completly I just wanted to clear that up, correct me if I'm wrong about anything.
questionable content
Always Born a Crime
questionable content
Age: 28
Gender: Female
Posts: 5604
May 28th, 2009 at 09:28pm
^ This is pretty petty, but polygamy refers to both marriages with mulitple husbands and multiple wives. Polygyny is a man taking multiple wives.
ennui.
Awake and Unafraid
ennui.
Age: 31
Gender: Female
Posts: 11393
May 29th, 2009 at 03:02am
questionable content:
John St. John:


The only reason why I mentioned women, is because I haven't heard a lot of women having multiple husbands.
I know it happens and that, I just hear a lot more about men having multiple wives.

If all parties are consenting, then I say go for it. And if certain religions practise it, I have no problem.
But in extremist religions e.g. the Fundamental Mormon Church, women and children are forced.
The illegalized version (WITHOUT CONSENT) of polygamous marriage is what I was referring to.
There's incest and statutory rape, and these are the only polygamous marriages I've 'heard' of,
which is why I believe it does exploit women, men and children.

Person0001
Always Born a Crime
Person0001
Age: 43
Gender: Female
Posts: 5099
May 29th, 2009 at 10:04am
The point is that no one is picketing the homes of these polygamists either, therefore, the Religious Right is definitely targeting gay people. It's discrimination.
Spirit of Jazz.
Motor Baby
Spirit of Jazz.
Age: 103
Gender: Female
Posts: 918
May 29th, 2009 at 04:11pm
^Not true... (though, I'm not totally disagreeing with you, as homosexuals seem to be targeted more often) Polygamists are discriminated against, same as any 'unorthodox' couple.
Person0001
Always Born a Crime
Person0001
Age: 43
Gender: Female
Posts: 5099
May 29th, 2009 at 04:52pm
Hopeless Romantic...:
Polygamists are discriminated against.
Show me the protests and literature and then maybe I'll believe it.

For now, here is the proof we've all been waiting for that homosexuality IS natural.
xxtoryxx
Killjoy
xxtoryxx
Age: 28
Gender: Female
Posts: 51
May 30th, 2009 at 10:20pm
I think that it is totily okay to a homo.(sry if insulting) I mean the way you look at someone is different to every one. its normily when you see someone that is hot or cute, I think that it is fine for a guy or a girl to like some one in the same gender, it doesnt make them any different. they are still a person.
Also people shouldnt think oh that person is weard cuz they are a homo. I say thats just stupid gosh. >.<
Alexface.
Salute You in Your Grave
Alexface.
Age: 31
Gender: Male
Posts: 3489
June 12th, 2009 at 01:31pm
Deb:
For now, here is the proof we've all been waiting for that homosexuality IS natural.
That has to be my favourite news story in quite a while. :') That's great. That should change the minds of at least a few people who seem to express that homosexuality is unnatural.