| Author | Message |
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MADIS0N.
Motor Baby
Age: 31
Gender: Female
Posts: 981 | August 18th, 2007 at 09:20am
Beeblebrox:
I think members of the christian faith are wrong to force their faith into schools, into offices, into the pledge of allegiance, the back of the dollar bill, the rulebooks and lawmakers of our country. Christians (not all, but most) tend to think of their religion as the "correct" one and all others are false, which really pisses off the rest of us who don't subsribe to christianity. This mentality is why the separation of church and state is so very difficult. We should be one nation, united under respect for each other.
Christian faith is only preached in Christian schools, for one. Do you see crucifixes or prayers in public schools? No. Are prayers said over the PA system? No. There is no Mass, chapel, etc. That all exists in private schools, and you have the option to not attend a Christian school.
And of course Christians thing their religion is correct. What's the problem in that? We believe Jesus was the Savior, Son of God. That why we're Christian, not Jewish...
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UndyingSoul.
Really Not Okay
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 722 | August 18th, 2007 at 05:58pm dorky_chick:Well to me religion is not fact, you can't possibly prove a God exists so to me you should not try to say that a god you can't prove is even there say something is wrong.
Then prove that God doesnt exist. |
UndyingSoul.
Really Not Okay
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 722 | August 18th, 2007 at 06:00pm AmanderBananer:Alice Cullen:I don't think that religion is a credible source to place facts on. We have no proof that anything in the Bible actually happened, and we're trusting a bunch of words written down by people. And TRANSLATED words, nonetheless, so we have no idea if the version we read is even correct.
I actually do agree with you, in some ways.
I think religion needs to stay out of government.
We are following rules of our lives, written by some guy thousands of years ago. Every year, something new is added to the bible...Soon it'll be saying
"Thou shall not listen to thou MP3 in Church"
I mean really.
Just because they believed this guy was 'awesome'.
I totally respect and accept anyone who does believe in God, don't get me wrong.
And I do understand that with faith, you have to trust the unknown.
But as I think (and someone else has mentioned) if the world was completely wiped, and put on was new people, and they found a Harry Potter book thousands of years later...They're gonna think that's how they lived all those years ago.
I mean, the bible is a great story, but that's all it is.
Sure, it's to teach you lessons, but not to ultimately live by.
And if reading the bible helped you stop drugs or stop being rude to people, well then that's great! But I don't think that this story should be brought into our politics and our governments decision making.
It's sort of like...
Random president : Well, we're not gonna attack this country, because the Bible says that violence is bad. Sure they are holding basically our whole country hostage and killing everyone...But we're not gonna fight back at all. Let God show them the way.
I mean, come on.
What if it gets to that?
Every religion is different, some show different ways to lead your life...So we can't just go by what 'God' wants us to do...because sometimes, we have to make our own rules. And own decisions. If you never make a decision by yourself...You're gonna be hit really hard when reality stops by and knocks on your door.
(hope I didn't offend anyone ^-^...just my opinion)
A lot of people on here are into proof. Some say that the Bible is all stories (like yourself), well then...prove it. |
Ignore Alien Orders
Salute You in Your Grave
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 2026 | August 18th, 2007 at 06:08pm Lil wheezy.:Beeblebrox:
I think members of the christian faith are wrong to force their faith into schools, into offices, into the pledge of allegiance, the back of the dollar bill, the rulebooks and lawmakers of our country. Christians (not all, but most) tend to think of their religion as the "correct" one and all others are false, which really pisses off the rest of us who don't subsribe to christianity. This mentality is why the separation of church and state is so very difficult. We should be one nation, united under respect for each other.
Christian faith is only preached in Christian schools, for one. Do you see crucifixes or prayers in public schools? No. Are prayers said over the PA system? No. There is no Mass, chapel, etc. That all exists in private schools, and you have the option to not attend a Christian school.
And of course Christians thing their religion is correct. What's the problem in that? We believe Jesus was the Savior, Son of God. That why we're Christian, not Jewish...
It's not the idea that you think you're right that bugs me, it's the idea that you think you're the only ones who are right. Different people experience faith in the divine in different ways, it's no one's place to tell anyone else how to do so.
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RedRiot.
Salute You in Your Grave
Age: 31
Gender: Female
Posts: 2482 | August 18th, 2007 at 08:43pm NotOkay22:dorky_chick:Well to me religion is not fact, you can't possibly prove a God exists so to me you should not try to say that a god you can't prove is even there say something is wrong.
Then prove that God doesnt exist.
We can neither prove or disprove whether there is a god or ultimate being. |
Ignore Alien Orders
Salute You in Your Grave
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 2026 | August 18th, 2007 at 08:56pm NotOkay22:dorky_chick:Well to me religion is not fact, you can't possibly prove a God exists so to me you should not try to say that a god you can't prove is even there say something is wrong.
Then prove that God doesnt exist.
My point exactly.
If it can't be proven either way, it should be left out of debates and decision-making processes that are supposed to rely on logic and science.
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UndyingSoul.
Really Not Okay
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 722 | August 19th, 2007 at 04:24am Dimestore Saint;;:NotOkay22:dorky_chick:Well to me religion is not fact, you can't possibly prove a God exists so to me you should not try to say that a god you can't prove is even there say something is wrong.
Then prove that God doesnt exist.
My point exactly.
If it can't be proven either way, it should be left out of debates and decision-making processes that are supposed to rely on logic and science.
Exactly. Saying that it's impossible for God to exist is no longer a valid argument, unless someone can prove that he doesn't exist, which is impossible, which is why people need to have faith to follow religion. |
Rhys Webb
Awake and Unafraid
Age: 32
Gender: Female
Posts: 12341 | August 19th, 2007 at 05:56am there is no way in hell reliigon can be used to prove something fact or myth. we don't even know how much of a certain reliigon is true. this is where people need to understand that science plays a major role in our everyday lives. |
Ignore Alien Orders
Salute You in Your Grave
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 2026 | August 19th, 2007 at 09:33pm NotOkay22:Dimestore Saint;;:NotOkay22:dorky_chick:Well to me religion is not fact, you can't possibly prove a God exists so to me you should not try to say that a god you can't prove is even there say something is wrong.
Then prove that God doesnt exist.
My point exactly.
If it can't be proven either way, it should be left out of debates and decision-making processes that are supposed to rely on logic and science.
Exactly. Saying that it's impossible for God to exist is no longer a valid argument, unless someone can prove that he doesn't exist, which is impossible, which is why people need to have faith to follow religion.
No, that wasn't what I was saying...
I was saying that God's existence is irrelevant in logical arguments. Faith is a very important thing to many people. I personally am agnostic but I believe in some sort of absolute presence...but I don't think that that should be involved where the burden of proof is logic and science. Basically you proved my point for me by pointing out that there's no way of telling whether there's a God or not.
I don't care if religion influences your opinions, but you have to be able to back up your arguments with the same things everyone else has to back up their arguments with. It wouldn't be very fair if atheists and agnostics had to use logic and science and all religious types had to do was say "God says so" and the argument is suddenly infallible, would it? |
girl interrupted.
Salute You in Your Grave
Age: 29
Gender: Female
Posts: 2792 | August 20th, 2007 at 12:08am Lil wheezy.:Beeblebrox:
I think members of the christian faith are wrong to force their faith into schools, into offices, into the pledge of allegiance, the back of the dollar bill, the rulebooks and lawmakers of our country. Christians (not all, but most) tend to think of their religion as the "correct" one and all others are false, which really pisses off the rest of us who don't subsribe to christianity. This mentality is why the separation of church and state is so very difficult. We should be one nation, united under respect for each other.
Christian faith is only preached in Christian schools, for one. Do you see crucifixes or prayers in public schools? No. Are prayers said over the PA system? No. There is no Mass, chapel, etc. That all exists in private schools, and you have the option to not attend a Christian school.
And of course Christians thing their religion is correct. What's the problem in that? We believe Jesus was the Savior, Son of God. That why we're Christian, not Jewish...
In my old school, they preached a lot about the Christian God, in
assemblies every morning, when there were numerous children of other
religions and backgrounds. Needless to say. that was not a Christian school.
Well, I kind of understand what you're on about, about Christians generally
thinking their religion is right. But I also get what Beeblebrox means. Like the
Christians (generally of course) think their religion is better than everyone
elses?
I'd just like to say, I live in Wales, GB, so our schools, and / or my wording may
be different to the USA's.
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Rhys Webb
Awake and Unafraid
Age: 32
Gender: Female
Posts: 12341 | August 20th, 2007 at 12:45am Shatterheart loser.:Lil wheezy.:Beeblebrox:
I think members of the christian faith are wrong to force their faith into schools, into offices, into the pledge of allegiance, the back of the dollar bill, the rulebooks and lawmakers of our country. Christians (not all, but most) tend to think of their religion as the "correct" one and all others are false, which really pisses off the rest of us who don't subsribe to christianity. This mentality is why the separation of church and state is so very difficult. We should be one nation, united under respect for each other.
Christian faith is only preached in Christian schools, for one. Do you see crucifixes or prayers in public schools? No. Are prayers said over the PA system? No. There is no Mass, chapel, etc. That all exists in private schools, and you have the option to not attend a Christian school.
And of course Christians thing their religion is correct. What's the problem in that? We believe Jesus was the Savior, Son of God. That why we're Christian, not Jewish...
In my old school, they preached a lot about the Christian God, in
assemblies every morning, when there were numerous children of other
religions and backgrounds. Needless to say. that was not a Christian school.
Well, I kind of understand what you're on about, about Christians generally
thinking their religion is right. But I also get what Beeblebrox means. Like the
Christians (generally of course) think their religion is better than everyone
elses?
I'd just like to say, I live in Wales, GB, so our schools, and / or my wording may
be different to the USA's.
i was going to say, doing that in america is illegal. you are not allowed to preach different religions in other public schools unless it is a catholic school. |
AmanderBananer
Killjoy
Age: 31
Gender: Female
Posts: 46 | August 20th, 2007 at 05:43am NotOkay22:AmanderBananer:Alice Cullen:I don't think that religion is a credible source to place facts on. We have no proof that anything in the Bible actually happened, and we're trusting a bunch of words written down by people. And TRANSLATED words, nonetheless, so we have no idea if the version we read is even correct.
I actually do agree with you, in some ways.
I think religion needs to stay out of government.
We are following rules of our lives, written by some guy thousands of years ago. Every year, something new is added to the bible...Soon it'll be saying
"Thou shall not listen to thou MP3 in Church"
I mean really.
Just because they believed this guy was 'awesome'.
I totally respect and accept anyone who does believe in God, don't get me wrong.
And I do understand that with faith, you have to trust the unknown.
But as I think (and someone else has mentioned) if the world was completely wiped, and put on was new people, and they found a Harry Potter book thousands of years later...They're gonna think that's how they lived all those years ago.
I mean, the bible is a great story, but that's all it is.
Sure, it's to teach you lessons, but not to ultimately live by.
And if reading the bible helped you stop drugs or stop being rude to people, well then that's great! But I don't think that this story should be brought into our politics and our governments decision making.
It's sort of like...
Random president : Well, we're not gonna attack this country, because the Bible says that violence is bad. Sure they are holding basically our whole country hostage and killing everyone...But we're not gonna fight back at all. Let God show them the way.
I mean, come on.
What if it gets to that?
Every religion is different, some show different ways to lead your life...So we can't just go by what 'God' wants us to do...because sometimes, we have to make our own rules. And own decisions. If you never make a decision by yourself...You're gonna be hit really hard when reality stops by and knocks on your door.
(hope I didn't offend anyone ^-^...just my opinion)
A lot of people on here are into proof. Some say that the Bible is all stories (like yourself), well then...prove it.
But it is a story. It's a story of how Jesus roamed around and helped people and showed people things, teaching them leasons and such. (or whatever he did...I don't exactly know everything, lol)
I never said fictional or non-fiction...but it is a story.
Anything written down in a book is a story. A story about Jesus' life on Earth (in this case) |
UndyingSoul.
Really Not Okay
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 722 | August 21st, 2007 at 08:09pm Dimestore Saint;;:NotOkay22:Dimestore Saint;;:NotOkay22:dorky_chick:Well to me religion is not fact, you can't possibly prove a God exists so to me you should not try to say that a god you can't prove is even there say something is wrong.
Then prove that God doesnt exist.
My point exactly.
If it can't be proven either way, it should be left out of debates and decision-making processes that are supposed to rely on logic and science.
Exactly. Saying that it's impossible for God to exist is no longer a valid argument, unless someone can prove that he doesn't exist, which is impossible, which is why people need to have faith to follow religion.
No, that wasn't what I was saying...
I was saying that God's existence is irrelevant in logical arguments. Faith is a very important thing to many people. I personally am agnostic but I believe in some sort of absolute presence...but I don't think that that should be involved where the burden of proof is logic and science. Basically you proved my point for me by pointing out that there's no way of telling whether there's a God or not.
I don't care if religion influences your opinions, but you have to be able to back up your arguments with the same things everyone else has to back up their arguments with. It wouldn't be very fair if atheists and agnostics had to use logic and science and all religious types had to do was say "God says so" and the argument is suddenly infallible, would it?
Oh I understood what you were saying, and I agree. Which is why unless I'm in a religious thread, I don't usually use my religious beliefs to back up my opinions. I agree that it should be left out of everyday debates and such because it cant be proven without bringing even more religion into the subject which will just screw everything up to an obnoxious degree.
God, or any other religious things, should not interfere with politics or any other non-religious debates. |
Ignore Alien Orders
Salute You in Your Grave
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 2026 | August 22nd, 2007 at 10:32pm Ah, okay. Sorry, I was being a little over-defensive.
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DIE! DIE! DIE!
Bleeding on the Floor
Age: 33
Gender: Female
Posts: 1067 | August 22nd, 2007 at 11:40pm Religion shouldn't have any influence on anything legal
I also feel that it is disrespectful to play rock music under a Christian label and have many songs about Jesus and God. That's like ignoring your fans that arn't Christian, because obviously, they don't want to hear that crap. I have no problem with motifs (Example: Family Force 5 sings about God a lot, but they mask the lyrics, and leave the religious parts for the people that listen clearly enough to hear them. It's amazing to me, and I totally respect them for that they are doing, because it makes it seem like they care about ALL of their fans...unlike SOME bands (Im looking at YOU Underoath)
Just thought this would contribute a bit. |
Ignore Alien Orders
Salute You in Your Grave
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 2026 | August 23rd, 2007 at 12:16am ^I don't have a problem with writing about whatever you want, but I think it's kind of silly to label yourself a Christian band if you aren't strictly worship. That's cutting off people who aren't religious or have other religions because it creates a bit of tension over that difference. Some of my favorite bands are religious and it doesn't bother me, but I wish people wouldn't label themselves as Christian bands if their music isn't worship-based. The Fray and Thrice both have Christian members and Christian themes in their music, and I think people should follow their lead in not labelling themselves as Christian bands...it's just another level of division.
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DIE! DIE! DIE!
Bleeding on the Floor
Age: 33
Gender: Female
Posts: 1067 | August 23rd, 2007 at 12:19am Yes, that seems right. I think we are really saying the same thing. |
postcollapse
Killjoy
Age: 30
Gender: Female
Posts: 7 | August 26th, 2007 at 11:00am I dont believe in religion.
Im not saying I hate all religious people.
Im saying I havent had good experience with them.
I am a HUGE harry potter fan, and one mother spread rumors around about me that I do drugs and worship Satan because I read Harry Potter.
From what I have learned, religion is just an excuse for people to get into bigger arguments and judge people. |
Thug Life.
Bleeding on the Floor
Age: 33
Gender: Male
Posts: 1315 | August 26th, 2007 at 02:54pm
Laws are based on morals and most of which are derived from religion. so there is no way your ever going to have a religion {christian} free legal system however it is plain to see that you cant make laws without morals so how else could we base laws without religion ?
its wrong to rape ? the bible and im sure other relgious teachings state this.
its wrong to steal the bible again
and many other laws that we have have originated from morals and teachings from religious text.
but with things like
stem cell research taht i feel strongly about religion can become a pain
gay marraige and lesbian addotion and ivf are all hindered by it. so in a way we cant have the law without religion but to get the things that i beleive are important social issues we have to get rid of religion.
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Ignore Alien Orders
Salute You in Your Grave
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 2026 | August 26th, 2007 at 10:00pm Nintendo:
Laws are based on morals and most of which are derived from religion. so there is no way your ever going to have a religion {christian} free legal system however it is plain to see that you cant make laws without morals so how else could we base laws without religion ?
its wrong to rape ? the bible and im sure other relgious teachings state this.
its wrong to steal the bible again
and many other laws that we have have originated from morals and teachings from religious text.
but with things like
stem cell research taht i feel strongly about religion can become a pain
gay marraige and lesbian addotion and ivf are all hindered by it. so in a way we cant have the law without religion but to get the things that i beleive are important social issues we have to get rid of religion.
Religion stemmed from sets of morals, not the other way around. The ideas existed before they were written down as the word of God. Religious law can be viewed as a kind of set of morals, but it's not the only source of morals. You'll notice that atheists and agnostics don't believe in any one creed, and yet most still have morals.
Besides, I'm no biblical scholar but I'm fairly sure rape is condoned a number of times in the Bible.
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