Abortions.
| Author | Message |
|---|---|
| papershoe Fabulous Killjoy  Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 159 | |
| Fezzik Salute You in Your Grave  Age: 31 Gender: Female Posts: 2748 | XpotatowillrockyouX: Once again, an embryo is not a human. There's no brain function. So therefore killing an embryo is not murdering anyone. It's just terminating the life of an unconscious bunch of cells. |
| papershoe Fabulous Killjoy Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 159 | Cigarettes And Suicide: this is very true but abortion is usually used for the wrong reasons. the mother of the child that has an not able to get an abortion should have to suffer the consequences but whos there to make her care for the baby? to stop her from killing it? now i would say she shouldnt kill a baby because shes to scared, but once again no one is there to tell her to care for it, or to not get an abortion. she shouldnt do it but she will, and if she is going to kill the baby since she cant get an abortion then what she might as well get an abortion?? its a horrible thing abortion, but what you said is true. what i think what should be done, bare with me here, is before the woman gets an abortion the doctor or whoever asks why? and sees if its a significant reason, if it is the procedure will be done, and if not she would get help from doctors and other people so someone would be there to tell her not to kill it, to face reality and realize shes having a baby. and if she continues to not want the baby the abortion might be considored, unless they could get somone else to care for the baby. do you get what im saying here?? though this wouldnt work either because she could just go ahead and lie about the whole thing making it a significant reason. maybe there should be an age limit then, you can barely get away with lying about your age most of the time, but that still wouldnt work out fairly. ... ahhh this is really confusing... |
| papershoe Fabulous Killjoy Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 159 | Fezzik: this is where it gets horrible to me. i have to disagree with you, when a baby is getting aborted its not just a buch of brain cells and tissue its, and no its not considored as murder, but instead an innocent life about to be taken away. and in most cases it isnt an embryo, the baby is at least 2 months developed. and whether it is an embryo or not, its an innocent life about to be taken away. and like i said unless it was a significant reason for it, it shoudntbe done. abortion is killing an innocent life and in my opinion taking away an innocent life is considored murder |
| Fezzik Salute You in Your Grave Age: 31 Gender: Female Posts: 2748 | XpotatowillrockyouX: It's considered an embryo before three months of pregnancy. And an embryo isn't really alive. It's alive the way sperm and egg cells are. Or the cells in our bodies that die every day. It's not a baby. It doesn't know the difference; but the mother does. |
| papershoe Fabulous Killjoy Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 159 | oh im sorry i thought it was considored a baby after a month, thankyou. and its exactly what you said, it doesnt know the difference, the mother does. whether its an embryo or not it doesnt deserve to not live because the mother made a foolish mistake, unless however the situation is abseluotley horrendous. |
| Cigarettes And Suicide Bleeding on the Floor  Age: 35 Gender: Female Posts: 1725 | XpotatowillrockyouX: Pre-op counselling is mandatory in most places (correct me if I'm wrong about the specific area in which you live, but in Australia, nobody is permitted to go through with the operation unless they have spoken to a counsellor to not only assess the mental state of the mother and determine what her specific reasons for terminating the pregnancy are, but to inform her of her options (foster care, adoption etc) and ensure that the mother has already thought about those options, and has still decided that abortion is the best-case scenario for her. That being said, a reason that you consider valid could be invalid as far as another person is concerned, and as always, the burden is on the mother, so if her reasoning makes sense to her, then nobody should tell her that she's wrong or taking the easy way out, because abortion is a traumatic experience for the mother and her decision shouldn't be questioned by anybody - only supported. And besides, if that scenario did come about, and doctors determined that the reason for wanting to terminate the pregnancy wasn't good enough and that she should 'wake up and realize she's having a baby', that doesn't help anybody at all - least of all the mother and her child-to-be. Again, what's to stop her from going through with the pregnancy, only to strangle the baby and dump it by the side of the road somewhere out of town? What's to stop her becoming a prostitute or drug dealer in order to find the money for diapers, formula, baby clothes and other things that are necessary? What's to stop the poor woman taking out her frustration and anger at her lowered position in life on her 'innocent child', who therefore would have been far better off being aborted before it developed, rather than abused or live in squalid conditions, or simply being aware its whole life that its mother never wanted it anyway, and now hates it for the simple fact that it exists and she's forced to look at it every day and be reminded of what could have been, if she'd only been granted a simple operation? Yes, in cases of abortion, it's not 'the baby's' fault, but the embryo doesn't know whether it's alive or dead, and therefore doesn't know any different if it gets terminated. It's not an 'innocent human being', it's about as human as a lump of kidney tissue - and you don't feel sorry for the lungs and livers of dead people who get transplanted into donor recipients, do you? No, you see the technology as a life-saver and absolutely necessary. Well, in my opinion, abortion is not a killer, it's a life-saver - in a lot of cases, it can save both the mother's life and save a child from a terrible life. I know that I would rather have been aborted, and not known any better, than been abandoned, placed in foster care, or had a horrible life because my parents couldn't or wouldn't provide adequately for me. And I know that if I fell pregnant with an unwanted child, and that baby ad the potential to ruin my life (get me fired from my job, make my partner leave me, drain my finances once it arrived, or affect my health), I'd rather get rid of it and go to therapy for a while, than destroy my life by giving birth to it, then have it adopted out and not only have to explain to my friends and family what happened to my big belly, but then forever wonder where my child is, how they're managing and who they've turned out to be. And, just FYI, abortions are no longer horrific butcherings of a woman's insides. It's a simple operation, similar to inducing an overdue labour, where the cervix is stimulated to open up, the embryo is simply scraped and vacuumed out, and the woman can go home and back to her normal life a day or two later. If abortion was made illegal again, there would still be backyard abortions using knitting needles and bent coathangers, which (duh) are absolutely horrific, not to mention extremely dangerous to the woman's health - the risk of infection from unsterile equipment and operating room (for eample, somebody's kitchen table), hemorrhage from rupturing something, infertility from internal damage... Yeah. Anyone who would rather abortion be outlawed needs to open their minds and look at the facts, not listen to the preaching picketers who blatantly ignore common sense and statistics and prefer to listen to the Bible. |
| Fezzik Salute You in Your Grave Age: 31 Gender: Female Posts: 2748 | XpotatowillrockyouX: But it's not that either she was raped or she was irresponsible. Sometimes women have responsible sex with long-term boyfriends, use birth control, and end up pregnant anyway. |
| papershoe Fabulous Killjoy Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 159 | though this is my opinion, they should still have the child. some woman use abortion as like birth control #2 or something. just incase actual birth control doesnt work, , or they just use it as regular birth control. i understand what your saying, but in my opinion in that situation abortion would not be good. and a situation like this is to close to using abortion for careless reasons, though it is not, its to close. |
| druscilla. Bleeding on the Floor  Age: 34 Gender: Female Posts: 1671 | I feel really bad for the kids whose mothers thought like you. The unwanted children that aren't really loved. The children shunted from foster home to foster home. The children who get abused and neglected. The children who didn't have to go through that. |
| papershoe Fabulous Killjoy Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 159 | ok yes your right but if the mother was responsible, and tought the kid some morals the mother wouldnt let that happen and neither would the child. now what your saying is what i considor a horrendous situation. where the mother is stupid enough, or doesnt know enough to not let that happen. once again in a situation like that then abortion would be acceptable in my opinion. where the mother, and i repeat "does not have a lot, no one to give the baby to, not that much money in the family, then in my opinion it might be considered." |
| papershoe Fabulous Killjoy Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 159 | many of you have brought up very good points that honestly i was to ignorant to realize, and i thankyou for bringing up these points. however i am not 100% ok with abotion, i feel once again that if there is not a significant reason than it should not be considored. and alot of what you all are saying is what i would considor to be a "horrendous situation", or a "significant reason", and i apalogize for not making that clearer. i considor vacuming out an embryo as killing or terminaing an innoccent life. however if the parent was not fit to be a responsible parent or the baby would suffer even more living than it would if it was just aborted than abortion by all means should be done. however if abortion is not abseloutley neccesary than it should not be done. what i considor not neccesary would be you are responsible enough to be a parent and the child would not suffer, even if a woman was having sex responsibly, or in some cases if a woman was raped but this is just my opinion. and i find it horrible when woman use it as birth control or something like that. and i never said abortion should be illegal because like most of you said, there would still be back-yard abortions, and an innocent baby would be killed. i just feel strongly about the fact that a lot of people use abortion irresponsibly. i hate that and im sure you could all agree with that. once again i apologize for not making what i said clearer. |
| Fezzik Salute You in Your Grave Age: 31 Gender: Female Posts: 2748 | I don't think anyone's 100% okay with abortion. I mean, no one wants high abortion rates. It's just that they should be available, because they can make such a huge and important difference in a person's life, and it prevents women from going to more drastic measures to terminate pregnancies. |
| Casimir Pulaski Day Shotgun Sinner  Age: 91 Gender: Female Posts: 8861 | Who is to decide if a reason is significant? A conservative party? |
| Cigarettes And Suicide Bleeding on the Floor Age: 35 Gender: Female Posts: 1725 | XpotatowillrockyouX: And that's half the point of these discussions - to inform the uninformed or otherwise educate those who aren't aware of facts and different perspectives, and if not outright change their minds about the subject, at least to make them aware that not everything is black-and-white, there are things they didn't yet know about certain situations, and that by doing some research or listening to the opinions of others, they may find their perspective becomes more open-minded and sympathetic towards those that these topics do affect. As Fezzik said, nobody is 100% all for abortion - I'm sure everyone would prefer it if abortion wasn't necessary, but the sad fact of life is, there are many cases all over the world, every single day, where it is necessary (whether you deem it 'necessary' or not, to the woman concerned, it is). Therefore, all we're arguing is that it should remain legal, and that a woman who has lived and breathed and walked around on this planet for 15 or more years, has far more rights than something that isn't really alive. That's why I'm for abortion - I'd prefer to make a choice concerning my own body, than have somebody who doesn't even know me, tell me that a tiny lump of flesh has more right to life than I do. |
| Carrie White Thinking Happy Thoughts  Age: 29 Gender: Female Posts: 416 | Fezzik wrote: But it's not that either she was raped or she was irresponsible. Sometimes women have responsible sex with long-term boyfriends, use birth control, and end up pregnant anyway. me: Thats because she didnt use birth control right, or their boyfriend didnt put the condom on right (or it just broke). anyway the point is that abortion is wrong, but a woman is able to make her own decisions. if she wants to have the baby, fine, if not whatever its her choice. abortion technically isnt murder because its not really living YET, but people (including me) think its wrong because you're not giving the baby a chance. if i was to get pregnant i'd have the baby no matter what, but thats just me. the point is the choice is up to the mother. |
| Cigarettes And Suicide Bleeding on the Floor Age: 35 Gender: Female Posts: 1725 | MCR Rocks: 1: condoms are not the only method of birth control that can be used. The Pill, Implanon, hormone injections, IUDs, the list is seemingly endless these days. And a lot of the new types of contraception coming out these days have been proven to have a 99.999% success rate (eg Implanon, which I used successfully for three years). In addition, newer birth control options have no 'instruction manual' or way of using them improperly or incorrectly - again, I'll use Implanon as an example - it's a plastic rod inserted under the skin on the inside of a woman's upper arm, and that's all there is to it for three years - no remembering to take pills, no worrying about tears in condoms... there is just no way to not use it properly. Same as hormone injections - you go to the doctor every three months, they give you a needle, and that's it - how can you possibly screw up in your utilisation of such a tool? You can't. And like I said, these methods are almost foolproof, so if a woman is using either of these options and it does fail, then I feel she's entitled to terminate her pregnancy if she wants to, because she has done absolutely everything in her power to prevent a pregnancy. And 2: Yes, the choice is up to the mother. I don't feel that having an abortion is wrong at all, because yes, as you said, the 'baby' isn't given a chance to live, but so what? It doesn't know any better, does it? It's not like people are taking toddlers out into a field and executing them. It's not like people are putting their babies in cardboard boxes and dumping them by the side of the road to die. The emryos are about as 'alive' as a pancreas, so if they get aborted, it's not hurting anybody except the mother (and she has made the choice to go through with it, so she will deal with it as she sees fit), therefore I see absolutely no problem with it. Besides, plenty of women get pregnant and either miscarry or have stillbirths, and nobody gets mad at them for being incapable of carrying a child to full-term, do they? Yet, these babies never got a chance to live either. Look at it that way. A woman has far more right to live her life the way she wants to, than a clump of cells. |
| Helena and Hearts Jazz Hands  Age: 28 Gender: Female Posts: 314 | murder! |
| druscilla. Bleeding on the Floor Age: 34 Gender: Female Posts: 1671 | Emo.Princess: a) Discuss. b) It's not murder. Murder: Law. the killing of another human being under conditions specifically covered in law. In the U.S., special statutory definitions include murder committed with malice aforethought, characterized by deliberation or premeditation or occurring during the commission of another serious crime, as robbery or arson (first-degree murder), and murder by intent but without deliberation or premeditation (second-degree murder). Abortion: The removal of an embryo or fetus from the uterus in order to end a pregnancy. |
| ChemicalReaction922 Fabulous Killjoy  Age: - Gender: - Posts: 114 | druscilla; in rags:I don't believe that abortion is murder...not in the least. My main reason for this is the issue of rape. Rape is a horrible thing and victims want to forget the event. Having a child because of rape, is just a reminder of that horrid event. It's the mothers decision (in the instince of rape) and both the parents decision when it's a teen pregnancy or and unwanted pregnancy. |
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