Juvenile Crime

Oops! Double post. Sorry about that.

Kaede:

^So are you saying that most 13 year olds are not capable of thinking for themselves?
From a lot of observation I had with children, they are already able to know what they are doing by the age of 10. In my opinion, children need a second chance but they still need to be punished in a way so they can learn from it. The worse thing that can happen is not taking any action at all for what they've done.

EDIT: I completely agree with Cigarettes and Suicide

Of course they can think for themselves. But, well, I work at a camp and spent a few days with the eight grade campers there (who would be thirteen or nearly that age). Pretty much all of them were self-centered, oblivious to nearly everything and everyone around them, and still rather childish and immature. That's not to say all thirteen year-olds are like that, but from memory and observation I think it's safe to say most are. It's just that at that stage of life people are so wrapped up in themselves that they don't really understand how their actions will affect others and the ramifications they may have on themselves. For example, two weeks ago, a few eighth graders from my camp snuck down the hill to another camp to use the vending machines there. They started off innocently enough throwing food at each other, but got so caught up that they ended up in a food fight and made a huge mess of candy and ice cream all over the place. When my camp's director found out she suspended them from that week's field trip. Several girls ended up in her office and the lobby, crying hysterically. They were so engrossed in the fun they were having that they didn't think of the mess they left for the janitors, their counselors, who got in trouble for not knowing where they were and who were probably fairly worried about them when they realized they were missing, or about the kind of trouble they'd get in when what they'd done was discovered. Of course that's not as bad as killing someone, stealing a car, causing serious property damage, etc., but it's really the same situation on a smaller scale. Sure, there are adults who act that way, and kids that age who don't, but generally thirteen year-olds and people in that age group lack the common sense, awareness of others, and basic foresight to fully comprehend the scope of their actions.

Fezzik:

Of course they can think for themselves. But, well, I work at a camp and spent a few days with the eight grade campers there (who would be thirteen or nearly that age). Pretty much all of them were self-centered, oblivious to nearly everything and everyone around them, and still rather childish and immature. That's not to say all thirteen year-olds are like that, but from memory and observation I think it's safe to say most are. It's just that at that stage of life people are so wrapped up in themselves that they don't really understand how their actions will affect others and the ramifications they may have on themselves. For example, two weeks ago, a few eighth graders from my camp snuck down the hill to another camp to use the vending machines there. They started off innocently enough throwing food at each other, but got so caught up that they ended up in a food fight and made a huge mess of candy and ice cream all over the place. When my camp's director found out she suspended them from that week's field trip. Several girls ended up in her office and the lobby, crying hysterically. They were so engrossed in the fun they were having that they didn't think of the mess they left for the janitors, their counselors, who got in trouble for not knowing where they were and who were probably fairly worried about them when they realized they were missing, or about the kind of trouble they'd get in when what they'd done was discovered. Of course that's not as bad as killing someone, stealing a car, causing serious property damage, etc., but it's really the same situation on a smaller scale. Sure, there are adults who act that way, and kids that age who don't, but generally thirteen year-olds and people in that age group lack the common sense, awareness of others, and basic foresight to fully comprehend the scope of their actions.

They don't lack it.
Most just choose to ignore it.

Fezzik:

^Common sense, you mean?
I don't think it should be fully expected of them to be able to summon it up when necessary.

Did you ever stop to think, that may be why some kids act so stupid?

Fezzik:

^Well, they are kids. It's one thing to respect them, quite another to expect them to grow up too quickly.

Yes. They are.
So are you and me.


I don't think asking a teenager not to burn down a building or murder somebody is asking to much or asking them to grow up to quickly.
God forbid they actually have to suffer consequences for something they already knew was wrong.
They just think that they're invincible and they cannot be caught.

Regarding the above posts (Fezzik & S713)... yeah, I mean kids can be stupid, and self-absorbed, but a food fight getting out of hand isn't illegal. Arson, murder, animal cruelty, child abuse, etc are, and most kids are aware of that.
Yes, kids should be kids, and sometimes they lose control and let things get away from them, but those things are usually harmless inconveniences like ths situation you mentioned, or they're circumstances where somebody could get hurt (eg games of dare, or reckless activity like playing with fireworks etc, stuff that they don't stop to think about the potential danger until after someone has to call an ambulance). But for the most part, these situations aren't illegal activity, and none of these kids would dream of stealing a car, mugging someone at knifepoint, or stabbing someone to death. Kids know that these situations are not only illegal, but have dire consequences, and avoid getting themselves into such situations.

So yeah, I'm with S713 - kids should be punished for committing criminal acts - they should damn well know better, self-absorbed or not.

Fezzik:

I don't think juveniles should be judged the same as adults - they should be educated and rehabilitated over punishment.

What about the juvies who know what they're doing? I recently saw a police video where there was a 13 year old kid who stole a car. Do you think that kid needs rehabilitation? Possibly, but it's better to lock them up like an adult and then have rehabilitation after they are in jail.

Fezzik:

Basically I just understand how a kid my age or younger could get into a criminal situation unintentionally and without really knowing the full consequences of what they're doing.

I don't understand...
I don't understand how a 16 year old (Year 10/ 11) cannot realise what they are doing or what the full consequences are.
But anyway, a crime is a crime and they should be punished for it, even though they are children. But if something happened by accident, then that's a different situation.

Jail is meant to be rehabilitation.
That was it's original purpose.
Of course it's not pleasant rehabilitation.

S713:

Jail is meant to be rehabilitation.
That was it's original purpose.
Of course it's not pleasant rehabilitation.

True. But in today's "oh they just need mental help" world jail is cruel and unusual punishment.

England is out of countrol when it comes to this. It seems that every other day, you switch on the news and the headlines are of another shooting or stabing, often being Fatal, even worse, it's mostly on teenagers.

And, it's basically because, at least in England, there is hardly a punishment.The punishment system is far too soft. A judge actually apolagised to a teen for locking him up for 5 years for carrying a knife.

An american poilceman had the right idea, i can't remember his name, but his idea is 'no tolerence' It's worked really well in America, and i think we should adopt i t here too.

Basically, it means actually putting the teens in prison for a good long time for minor offences. Rather than doing what we are doing and letting them out in a couple of months.

MrRandomGuy:

S713:

Jail is meant to be rehabilitation.
That was it's original purpose.
Of course it's not pleasant rehabilitation.

True. But in today's "oh they just need mental help" world jail is cruel and unusual punishment.

Saying "oh they jsut need mental help" is starting to seem too spine-less. Almost every case involving children will mention maybe this child needs some attention, that they're not mentally stable.

I think you need to reprimand children once, if it happens again, off toj ail with thee.

A couple of weeks ago I was reading about the two 10 year old boys in England who took a little 2 year old from the mall and beat him to death then left him on the train tracks. I was disgusted to hear that the two boys (who are now adults) served their sentence in a juvinille center thingy and then they were let out given new names identities etc. I find this completly unfair that they can just go on and rebuild their lives after taking someones son or brother or grand son or friend away. I also really want to know what was going through their minds and I want to know how two normal 10 year olds can kill someone or something.

I heard about that. I think that's just wrong. If you take someone's life you shouldn't just get off scott free or something. But I'm not talking about the eye for an eye theory. But given new identities? To protect them? The should have the living shit beat outta them. Hopefully in juvie they did. But they should spend the rest of their lives in jail, instead of getting out.

[sorry about the rant]

But that's part of my stance of Juvinile Crime, if a kid does something like kill someone, they should spend the rest of their teenage years in Juvinial Detention and then go to Prision. And other acts should follow like that.

Young people (Under eighteen) shouldn't be let off loose because they are young.
Take the amount of knife crimes and murders in England at the moment, most of them by young people. The little boy, Rhys, from Liverpool, we was shot on his way home from football practise, he was just ten. He was murdered by someone under eighteen.
Alchohol and bad upbringings are to blame.
It is disgusting how these children, and yes, i will use the term 'children' because that is technically what they are, commit such crimes, and then are let off with light sentences.

^ Hehe sorry, but I LOVE your avatar! Hehe!

Okay, so no, they shouldn't be let off. But they shouldn't be judged as strictly as adults