Obesity
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| thank fsm. In The Murder Scene  Age: 36 Gender: Female Posts: 20564 | Mindfuck: I agree that it shouldn't cost more than what you paid, but in truth it typically costs a great deal more. A small bunch of red-leaf lettuce costs $2 for me at the least expensive grocery store in town. The only difference between organic and non-organic is that organic doesn't use pesticides in its production, which is good, but is not often detectable to the eye. I mean, sometimes it's smaller and not as gorgeous produce, because usually the plump and brightly-colored stuff is waxed up and pumped full of chemicals. But organic isn't a highly visible attribute. Another thing is that obesity isn't usually caused simply by not eating healthy foods. Unhealthy foods can cause health problems, but it is only when they are consumed in very large amounts and not properly metabolized that they actually cause obesity. y/n? |
| Richey Edwards. Demolition Lover  Age: 31 Gender: Female Posts: 16507 | I agree. I mean, its not youre gonna gain 25 pounds if you eat a cheeseburger every now and then. But it could catch up to you if you dont exercise or eat healthier foods at other times. A lot of times I hear that unhealthy food taste better than healthy food, and thats why people choose it. But I think most healthy food is good. I love fruit and some veggies. So I really dont think thats a good excuse. But what do you guys think about the people who are obese because of a medical condition or a medication they have to take? Do you think they should be treated the same? |
| riot reality Jazz Hands  Age: 29 Gender: Female Posts: 295 | John St. John: If you're turning to something for comfort, though, doesn't that mean that there's something wrong? Sure, a lot of people have a couple servings of potatoes or an extra bowl of ice cream when their sad, but when someone does that so much that they become obese, then I think their problems are definitely not under control. I'm guessing it has something to do with depression a lot (but not all) of the time. I'm not saying that obesity is a metal issue in itself, but maybe it could, sometimes, be an effect of one? I hope I'm saying this right. |
| Mindfuck Always Born a Crime  Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 5614 | riot reality:Obesity isn't a psychological problem, but something like overeating is a psychological problem, and it can be a type of eating disorder. That's not to say all obese or overweight people have a problem with overeating, but food addiction could be an issue for some. It's not unheard of. I think it can be just as bad as something like anorexia, in terms of health. Often people will say they eat when they're bored just because, or they don't know when to stop eating, or they eat a certain food because of the way it tastes, not because they are hungry. These can all be seen as psychological problems, but I don't believe it's necessarily linked to something like depression. I think some people can just be addicted to food. |
| Coraline. Thinking Happy Thoughts  Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 493 | Honestly,if your obese,it's no one else's fault but yours. You can blame as many food companies as you want,as many doctors,as many physcological problems and as many other issues. But it takes your own determination to get back to a healthy weight. If someone is obese,then they made themselves that way,no one shoved food down thier throat. They make a choice weather to eat or not,and they choose to. theres most likely alot of factors that influence a persons increase in eating,but at the end of the day,its down to that person to control themselves. And im aware this sounds rude,but im being nothing more than blunt. Food is a choice,you eat it or you dont,to remain healthy and keep a healthy body weight you yourself are happy with,you have to control your food intake. Theres nothing wrong with over snacking every once in a while,but obesity can cause serious problems leading to death. People dont accept this,and honestly anyone that replies to this,i wont be suprised if you dont agree with me. But at the end of the day,its quite easy to go buy fruit and veg rather than junk food. Instead of sitting around watching tv,you could be watching it whilst on a treadmill. Matter of fact is people are lazy. |
| Mindfuck Always Born a Crime Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 5614 | Coraline.:You seem to assume that all obese / overweight people are lazy who sit in front of the TV all the time and don't eat fruit and vegetables and only eat junk food. That's a really damaging stereotype, and obese and overweight people do not deserve to be labelled as such as a group - because there are a lot of overweight and obese people who have jobs, who may not have time to watch TV or who love to cook fresh food. Yes, there are some who are lazy and who eat junk and who watch TV a lot. But not all are like that, and there are skinny people who are like that too. |
| Coraline. Thinking Happy Thoughts Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 493 | Thats not what im trying to say. Yes,ofc everyone is lazy,but in most cases its sheer lack of willpower. And as i said,here comes in the excuses,a job. Not all people work on the weekends,they could excercise then. And just because you have a job,doesnt mean you cant go to the store and buy healthy food,its a choice. And people choose not to,instead they go for offers on junk like crisps. I know alot of people who have been on liquid diets,some with gastric bands,and very few who have dieted sucessfully. And they wont deny that it takes effort,the ones who have dieted sucessfully will even say its down to lazyness if your not suceeding,and thats the people i share my view with. If someone wants to be of a healthy weight from obesity,theres no question about it. They have to excercise and eat healthy,or take one of the quick easy options out,a liquid diet,gastric band,or any other method. Theres no room for excuses such as a job,or thier favorite shows on,or thier too busy. I know for a fact busy means doing nothing. |
| Mindfuck Always Born a Crime Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 5614 | Coraline.:I never said having a job was an "excuse" to be lazy and not exercise. I was merely refuting your generalisations about obese people. The problem with your argument is that it can apply to ANYONE is society, not just obese people. Sure, obese people need to exercise just as much as anyone does. But repeatedly touting the "junk food" argument doesn't make it very strong. Instead of coming across as making a solid point, to me you're just re-hashing the same old arguments that come up when obesity is the topic - how lazy they are, how they don't eat any healthy foods, how they lie and say they're busy when they're actually doing nothing (and you, for some reason, say it like it's a fact). Obesity is a problem, but it doesn't help any to heap tired stereotypes of fat people, such as the laziness and the constant junk food eating. What is it with junk food? It's not the only type of food that makes you fat. I'm not making excuses for being fat, I'm just saying it's not fair to lump obese and overweight people in the "never exercise, only eat junk" pile. And that's what you've done, even though you said "that's not what I was trying to say". This post of yours just reinforced it, from my view. |
| doctor. In The Murder Scene  Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 23302 | Coraline.:You say 'not all' people work on weekends but what about the ones that do? The people with erratic shift patterns who literally don't have time to exercise? Yes, many people don't work weekends and COULD exercise then but, perhaps, after a hard weeks work, exercise is not their first priority. Not everyone has the time at weekends particular if they're also looking after children, doing housework, seeing loved ones and then relaxing a little. You said people could watch television on a treadmill. Have you thought about the price of a treadmill? Not everyone can afford to buy their own treadmill or pay for a gym membership as they are both expensive things to maintain. Once you're overweight and especially obese, it also becomes incredibly difficult to excersise due to shortness of breath and other health problems so perhaps this isn't as practical for everyone as they'd like. And what about the people with low metabolism rates who struggle to lose weight easily yet put weight on very quickly, through no fault of their own 'laziness'? 'Busy means doing nothing'. So you think everyone who says they are busy is, in fact, lying on the couch pigging out? No one really does have busy lives at home or at work? Healthy food may also be an alternative but, at times, it is not satisfying, some people do not simply like the taste. Often, home cooked meals are swapped with microwave meals contributing to this weight put on. However, these are often bought due to the restricted amount of time some people have to eat. Again, take my example of shift workers, those who work long hours or those who have both a family and work to uphold. Sometimes it's not as black and white as 'Buy different food, eat less, exercise more'. (I know this may seem ridiculous considering I don't post on ino any more but I was procrastinating and slightly offended by this comment despite the fact I am of a healthy weight) |
| Coraline. Thinking Happy Thoughts Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 493 | And again,i said you wouldnt like it,and again,your over reacting to what i mean And treadmills whilst watching tv? It was just an example. You could lift wieghts,yoga,etc,theres alot of things that wont cause bad breathing and that person can do it in thier own time. Weather its buying thier own gym equitment,making thier own gym equitment or even googling things on the net. And i didnt say obesity isnt a problem either thankyou,quite clearly it is,theres a topic for it,its all over the media. And again,i also havnt said ALL obese people are like this. I said all people are lazy,and it involves will power to maintain a healthy weight. Obese people arent disabled,they still have mobility on the most part unless its an extreme case,they can excercise,eat well,and feel good about themselves. Im not making a generalisation,i know how hard it is for some people to loose weight Ive saw it first hand for god sake! I know first hand,on all accounts what it is like to be obese. It takes will power to get off of the sofa and do the excercise to improve your own life. 'buy different food,eat less,excercise more' Yes,and again,different factors involved. Low metabolism rates? I mentioned the other alternitives,gastric bands,liquid diets. Its that person's choice and that person's only on what they do with thier body. And where work and famalies are involved,you can easily fit your family into your excercise,you can make it fun. Work,you could do from home,or you could take something to your office like some weights,and do this. Again,only an example. There are ways round everything,and this is what i mean by excuses,everyone ignores the fact that there is an easy resolotion. You have both over read into what ive said,but it just goes to show that there is something worth fighting against. I know,and understand,and NEVER said that all obese people are generally lazy,i said WE ALL ARE. Not once,did i make any comment,and every reference to people,has been all people,not obese people in general. And i also said,that i was being blunt,its quite clearly not what people want to hear,but if no one says it obesity will be ignored. We cant all have the nice attitudes towards it. I honestly think all body types are beautiful,but obesity is a problem,when your overwieght,that is when you need to make the changes. |
| Coraline. Thinking Happy Thoughts Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 493 | Quote And there you go,ive just said it applies to anyone,i didnt once say its obese people in general. I said EVERYONE,ALL PEOPLE. Not people who are obese. |
| Mindfuck Always Born a Crime Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 5614 | Coraline.:And you think you're the first person to come out and say people are lazy? Er, no. Thousands of people have said it before you. I don't disagree that it's a problem, I think more should be done to combat obesity on a personal level individually, and also at a societal level. And it isn't your 'bluntness' (if that's what you call it) that I have a problem with. What I have a problem with is the generalisations I felt you made. Which I've already explained in the last two posts. You can say you didn't make any all you like, but I disagree: But at the end of the day,its quite easy to go buy fruit and veg rather than junk food. Instead of sitting around watching tv,you could be watching it whilst on a treadmill. Matter of fact is people are lazy. Those points you made were generalisations, and they assume that people who are fat generally a) don't eat fruit and vegetables (you said it's quite easy to buy fruit and veg, that assumes people already don't buy it) and b) that all fat people obviously watch a lot of TV, so they have enough time to work out in front of it. |
| Coraline. Thinking Happy Thoughts Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 493 | For the last time,chill out. I havnt said it's about fat people,or obese people,or extremely skinny people. ive used the word people,which includes everyone,not just people with weight issues. And what i've said is right,ive gave you an example of what you could be doing instead of doing something else repeatedly. So please,do me a favour and stop reading so much into what im saying. Im not saying fat people sit infront of thier tv's,i said PEOPLE. You can easily do what you enjoy and keep healthy at the same time! Quote For god sake,no. THAT,is the only generalisation ive made. Not enough people are being blunt and stating that its quite easy to change your lifestyle choices,again,It's willpower,nothing else. Most people are mostly,aww,thier overwieght,poor them,lets give them an easy option and not help them change thier life for the better,we'd rather pity them and watch them die. Quote Yes,alot of assuming there. And now my turn Quote And again,an option of doing something you like,and something thats a chore mixed. saying its easy to go buy fruit and veg RATHER than junk food,means replacing the things you buy.you have a choice,you either pick between the chocolate biccies or the fruit salad. And again 'people' main word being 'people' Not people with obesity Your stressing on the fact that im making generalisations on obese/fat people? I've said nothing about that,i've not said oh fat people should eat more fruit and veg or fat people should excercise ive said to maintain a healthy weight that your happy with,you need to eat healthy and excercise, by your own choice. So stop making assumptions,there is no arguement,this is discussion. |
| Mindfuck Always Born a Crime Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 5614 | Coraline.:But this thread is about obesity, not about everyone being lazy. So naturally because we're in the Obesity thread it makes it look like you're talking about obese people. Coraline:...This is the Discussion forum, you can't write something on here and expect no one is going to read into it or take it a certain way. If I see something I disagree with, I say it. Coraline:And I realise that. A lot of people use a treadmill in front of the TV. I don't disagree with your idea. But from the way it was written, it sounded like you were grouping everyone together, as if everyone has time to work out in front of the TV - some people don't even have the time to watch TV. I was just pointing that out Coraline:In my experiences, it's the opposite. We live in society that frowns upon obese people. Some people pity them, but some people also critisize them harshly without acknowledging personal circumstance or lifestyle. Some people are very quick to judge an obese person. I don't think it's wise to be soft on obesity. I don't like it. I'd love it if everyone was their ideal weight, and if everyone ate healthily and exercised. There's a difference between being realistic, and critisizing and stereotyping unnecessarily. Coraline:Well, yes. Everyone has that choice. I don't quite understand why you're reiterating this point. There are a lot of people who already choose fruit over chocolate biscuits and the like, and people of all body types. |
| Coraline. Thinking Happy Thoughts Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 493 | And that is my point! Both of you are accusing me of saying this is obese people in general,ive used the word people repeatedly,delibrately. Everyone has the same choices when it comes to food,obesity is an eating disorder. Anorexia is an eating disorder. Anorexics choose not to eat. People who are obese,choose to over indulge,or generally cant help it. But on both cases its choice,and weather that person gives in to their wants and needs. Ive been realistic,ive shown you that you can excericse and enjoy yourself. But when you accused me of insulting 'fat' people,that got on my tits (Y) Im all for self loving,curvy people,skinny people,but eating disorders are where you need help. And when you get to a certain stage,you have to take the blame before you can move forwards,you cant blame it on food companies,your daily activities,work. yes,they may be all factors that contribute,but the main factor is that person themselves and what they choose to do with thier life. I didn't make generalisations,i wrote all of this in a hurry because i was doing coursework at the same time,so obviously i havnt elaborated my point enough. But both of you have the wrong end of the stick. All im saying is that its easy to make the change,you either take an easy way out or you do it the hard way and feel better in the end. And mindfuck,you gave me advice on the weight topic in the personal forum? You admitted its about quantity,not the food you eat. But junk food is generally higher in things that are going to make you gain weight,and the more a person eats of it,the more they will gain. Yes,this person might be eating fruit and veg also,but its the over eating thats the problem. So by trading your favorites with even lower fat versions if thats what your going to agree with,it can do alot. Quote And anyone can become obese,i was merely pointing out that its that persons responsibility. And to be honest,i think you'll find most people dont want to do excercise or eat healthy. Its too much effort,or it takes up too much time,no one looks for the comprimise,and if they do,thats when you know thier ready to sort themselves out. |
| doctor. In The Murder Scene Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 23302 | Mindfuck:And this is my point exactly, in the discussion forum, are you not free to read into what people are saying? Hence providing the discussion. Personally, I do not feel either of us were over-analysing your points just arguing with what you had put in front of us. Again, maintaining a discussion. Corlaine:You must understand that, due to the fact we are in a Discussion thread about Obesity, your point was going to be interpreted to mean obese people in particular as saying it for all people would be somewhat irrelevant. As it happens I don't believe I need to 'chill out' as I was not typing in an aggressive manner at all. However, I do apologise if at any point I seemed harsh, I thought I came across fair but, each to their own, or misunderstood your point. |
| Coraline. Thinking Happy Thoughts Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 493 | Its came off in an agressive manner from both of you though,you can look throughout all this site,and not once have i said that all body sizes arent beautiful. And it seemed more argumentive than discussion to be honest. And ive said from the very start,people wouldnt like what i said,generally because its not the view people 'like' to hear. People,including obese people,including skinny people,including average people. Its all the same,it's an eating disorder. I do think,yovue both misunderstood my point,and ill make ti clearer next time. But in my last comment and the one before that,ive involved topics for discussion. None of you have commented on that,all youve really commented on is my use of wording. So to be honest,thats quite irrelavant too. |
| Jenny. Moderator  Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 19720 | Coraline.: Honey, you're the only one in this discussion who is being anything but calm and collect. This is a discussions forum and there will be people who disagree with you. Not everyone who disagrees with you is neccessarily "freaking out" on you. It's just differing opinions, and you are generalising a lot with people and stereotyping them. There are a lot of different factors of obesity, it's not just a matter of "they're lazy and fat and eat nothing but junk". |
| Mindfuck Always Born a Crime Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 5614 | Coraline.:Yes, and we're in the Obesity topic. So generally people are probably going to take it you're talking about obese people. You probably didn't intend for that - but we are in the Obesity topic supposedly talking about obesity. Not everyone in society. So why you're talking about "everyone" doesn't make sense to me. Coraline:Not necessarily. One doesn't need to even eat what society considers 'junk food' (i.e chocolate, chips, lollies, soft drinks etc) to gain a lot of weight. You can gain a lot of weight from overeating things like pasta, potatoes, bread (not just white bread, but even wholemeal and wholegrain breads too) etc. - things that aren't considered junk, but are usually part of an everyday normal diet. So I imagine some people don't even eat a lot of 'junk', some may just overeat 'normal' things, like carbs. Coraline:And again with the generalisations about people. Where are you getting this information about what most people think in society? How do you actually know what most people in society do or don't want? Exercise does take effort, but I personally don't feel people are as lazy as you think they are. I don't know what crowd you hang around with. Coraline.:No one is disputing that you don't find all body sizes beautiful. In fact, I personally never mentioned anything about your personal view on what's beautiful. Coraline:I don't quite know why mentioning this is important to anything. So you're touting a - what you think is - an unpopular opinion? It actually isn't. I'm inclined to feel that there are many others who probably have the exact same opinion as you. Coraline:The only reason why you think it's irrelevant is because I get the feeling you don't like people disagreeing with you so strongly. But how one words things in a discussion - or a debate - is actually very important, and very relevant. Because wording can make all the difference in an argument. One can use emotional language, or scientific, logical language, or persuasive language; basic communication rhetoric. One can make generalisations, or be very specific. One can make unsubstantiated claims, or use accurate and up to date facts and figures. Etc. Language and how one words things is quite relevant. |
| Coraline. Thinking Happy Thoughts Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 493 | I said from the very start people would disagree with me! But this has turned into an arguement more than a discussion,im allowed an opion,im allowed a view. And for the last time,ive made no generalisations,your ignoring my point which ive said about ten times now. Ive honestly just stopped reading this properly now,your all commenting on my laungage and how fat people are lazy,not all people are. Im from britan,im going to guess your both from the us or somewhere else,but things are different here. There are scientific researchs,theres documentarys,theres media. In this country,half the people who are obese,arent even aware. And when they do find out,they dont change it. As i've said,ive seen the struggle obesity is first hand. it takes work. In britan,theres a healthy life campaign,generally because they found all kids are eating too much crap which could lead to obesity. Everyones going mental overthe fact you should have five a day,again because the found out people werent. All of this can LEAD to obesity. Id like to have an actual discussion now,rather than you both picking apart irrelevant parts of what im saying,cus this has been a whole page of this now. Your allowed to disagree,but disagree on an actual point and give your opinion. Cus this is more of a personal arguement against me now,not anything else. ive said my view on obesity,most people dont care of themselves,most will become obese,you can stop this by eating healthy and excercising. You can make simlpe choices than can change the rest of your life. Quote Im actually the only person giving a view rather than having a go,and i didnt say the fact they disagree was them freaking out,the way its composed comes across angry and that is where i said chill out. And again,IVE MENTIONED THE FACTORS. And ive apolisigised if it lookeed like i made generalisations and said i ddint! IM getting sick of this now,i want a discussion,not a personal pissy arguement. Ive gave you a good amount of things to comment on,other than you think im a bitch for stating it's that person's responsibility. |
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