Smashing Pumpkins
| Author | Message |
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| mccrack. Salute You in Your Grave  Age: 36 Gender: Female Posts: 3660 | |
| silverrain Thinking Happy Thoughts  Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 453 | ^^^^ Do you mean this one?  Porcelina sent it to me  Isn't this like Christmas and having birthday together?!!  |
| mirarle Thinking Happy Thoughts  Age: 34 Gender: Female Posts: 492 | |
| porcelinajune Bleeding on the Floor  Age: 42 Gender: Female Posts: 1278 | |
| porcelinajune Bleeding on the Floor Age: 42 Gender: Female Posts: 1278 | |
| porcelinajune Bleeding on the Floor Age: 42 Gender: Female Posts: 1278 | mirarle: I know this post made me happy as well  And agreed the more the merry in these amazing pumpkins discussions. So jump in at any point. That is what has always been so great about the pumpkins: great music and great intelligent fans that lends itself to excellent discussion not only about the music/band itself but how it relates to life in general.silverrain: I couldn't agree more. It is so mind blowing to think of him being around my age when Simease Dream came out. At the time in my mind, I knew he was still young but someone like you said looked up to (it's hard to wrap your mind around 26 at 13/14) just seemed like he was at this mythically cool age. Does that make sense to anyone? I found the article I posted so interesting because I really don't think I have ever heard a someone talk so candidly about the inner workings of their band like esp. if they are finding fault with others in the band. I think you are right Silverrain it seems as if maybe other members seeme to take the band lightly while it was Billy's driving force. I also agree this harshness is probably for self-protection esp. after reading his journal thing and reading about the type of childhood he had. From this interview though, I can certianly see where people got the impression he had this "rockstar" attitude. But I think it is rather fucking impressive the he did most of Simease Dream by himself . . .I mean this in my opinion is one of the greatest albums of all time. silverrain:  I had completely forgotten about that. Took me a bit but I found the contents of said fax:"I'm glad that I'm such a good rhymer, Better than being a social climber, Just because I'm a bit brighter, Than some fucking writer." And I didn't know that about the concerts either. I think it is kind of funny/unique cause so many bands put the pressure on to be "perfect" and have each show run as planned but I like the idea of going into a show not knowing what the fuck you might get. It's kind of like that video I posted earlier where in the middel of the show Billy goes off on the music business and stuff. silverrain: !!!! Don't think it could have been put better  It's kind of funny that I/We relate SP/MCR and Gerard has said they want to model their careers somewhat after that pumpkins but as we have commented before the inner dynamics of the band are 100% different. Do you think this has to do more with MCR being from our generation and things were different with the pumpkins generation? Not sure what I am trying to get at here . . . .Or is just the personalities within each band that cause the different dynamics? As for the new title, I called up my friend who studies Hegel (the philospher who coined the term zeitgeist) to ask him exactly what this meant. LOL Of course, I fogot most of it as soon as I got off the phone. He said it is interesting that they would chose to name the album that because nobody really holds to the belief of zeitgest anymore and kind of teaches agains it. Basically, a leading up to a particular manifestation of past events/destination that reflects the "spirit of the times" I don't think this is quite right but when he explained it . . it made complete since why the album would be named this. I am still not sure my feelings on it . . .I don't dislike it . . . .it just makes ya think wonder . LOL  It is obvious this album is going to be heavily message laden. Anyone else think this? Wow . . .this summer is packed with too much excitement for this poor librarian's heart LOL. I am telling you July will be insane. New Pumpkins album and the ending of Harry Potter . . .so wierd. Something I hold close to my soul begins again and something I have spent many a hour over coffee with friends discussing ends. Okay well. Hope everyone is doing grand out in pumpkinland! Hope the ending of your week is full of pumkinyumminess and MCR hotness!  |
| mccrack. Salute You in Your Grave Age: 36 Gender: Female Posts: 3660 | porcelinajune: Doesn't that translate into "Time Ghost" or something? Someone told me 30 minutes ago what it meant and I've already forgotten  Anyway, a) I'll get to uploading the audio of Gerard talking about Billy being a fan of MCR once I can find it. I haven't forgotten, don't worry :] and b) I'm listening to MCIS front-to-back, whole way through, for the first time in a very long time. I forgot how much I missed this. Pumpkin Queen said new cd was going to sound like SD/MCIS, right? I can't wait. |
| silverrain Thinking Happy Thoughts Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 453 | Hey my sweet MCR-loving pumpkinheads  Awesome news! You’re doing a very good job in keepin us pumpkinheads informed, porcelina! I’m always too late I’m a little bit surprised too about this title choice…sounds strange for a record first…but they had always unusual album titles.... Cool you’ve got such a well-informed friend, Mandy; I’ve already said that I find it very impressive that he’s teaching philosophy! But I can understand why you’ve forgotten most of the Hegel-stuff very soon. I find it really brain-twisting to follow the way of thoughts old those old philosophers (so it’s quite fascinating how highly educated they must had been to develop their theories). But I think the thing you could remember  do make sense. “Zeitgeist” is actually a German word (it’s sounds sometimes funny to me to hear it in the middle of an English sentence…like “kindergarten”). And yep if you translate it, it’ll be the “spirit of time” or “spirit of the age”(Zeit = time or age; geist= spirit) as your friend said. (but you're right uncle jiggy that Geist can also be translated as Ghost as well, but this is more in the sense of “being haunted by ghosts or by the ghost of someone” or “the ghosts of the dead”). I think the term Zeitgeist is used in the same sense in English as in German: it can be used in the literal sense as “the spirit of a certain age or decade/century”, i.e. either the ideas and feelings of a generation or age that are new and characteristic from the previous ones or an era’s popular features as e.g. its youth culture expressed in music or fashion, or it can be used in the broader sense of the philosophical theories of the “Zeitgeist”. I had to read a tiny little bit about the Zeigeist-theory for my paper about Heinrich Mann (Thomas Mann’s brother who was also an author), who was influenced by it. What I’ve got form it is that H. Mann, who was, not very surprisingly, very pessimistic about his own age, kept his confidence and his faith in a better future by believing that history consists of as series of different eras (good and bad ones) in which finally human reason or common sense will prevail. So he believed that the French Revolution had been a highpoint so far and that his own age (WW I and WW II) was a downfall again that would finally be overcome by reason and humanity. Don’t know if this is very illuminating…but it helps me to understand this theory a little bit better. Ummm…I’m wondering if the new album title refers more to the literal sense or to a philosophical theory . . .and what about the supposed political content? What did the pumpkin queen think what the title would be? Okay, I don’t have much time right now  …just wanted to share my excitement about the new album and my little knowledge about “Zeitgeist”, before I’ll have forgotten my thoughts. But I will definitely come back later to the other things you've said. And thanks uncle jiggy for uploading the Gee/Billy audio! And thanks Mandy for the Billy-quote! So long for now |
| silverrain Thinking Happy Thoughts Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 453 | I’m back…okay what else did I want to answer?mirarle: LOL porcelinajune: Yep the mythically cool age…and then when you reach it yourself the myth is gone! I don’t really know…as a teenager I’ve always considered people who are somewhat under 22 year-olds even, if they’re twens already, still as very young….and people over 30 or 35 as getting wrinkly soon (okay this perspective definitely changes!) But the mid-twenties have been in my eyes this certain age between being totally young and being a settled adult. Poor mid-twens are always more or less lost in between having emotional trouble with unstable relationships, finding the right partner, and finding a direction in life or a job at all. At the same time, they’re still adventurous and ready to try new things and take risks. And I think Billy wrote his most creative and unusual music during these years. And he could always tell from a range of life experiences he already had had. And this made him say some things and write lyrics that sounded really wise in my ears. Okay…these are my two cents…hope it makes some sense.porcelinajune: Ummm…good question…but a tough one…I definitely would say the personalities make a difference. Gee may resemble Billy in his facial features, but in character I wouldn’t say so, plus (as we’ve said) Gerard doesn’t have the same outstanding role that Billy has as being the chief pumpkin (and yep it’s truly amazing that he really did SD almost on his own.) After he has managed his alcohol problem, Gerard appears as focussed on his work as Billy, but more cautious and deliberated about his actions. He’s always so friendly and polite in his recent interviews, you can hardly imagine him losing his temper towards others as Billy  might have done. Then there is only Mikey who seem to be a bit unsteady sometimes but Bob, Frank and Ray give the impression of being really stable characters. You couldn’t say this about D’arcy and Jimmy; by contrast, Billy learnt to deal with his personal problems very early, I guess. Then Gerard and Mikey probably had a much more steady childhood.But the generation aspect is interesting to think about…I’m not sure yet. What are your ideas? And yep, uncle jiggy. I can see what you mean by plunging completely into the MCIS-world by listening to it front-to-back. I don’t know how to put it, but for me it’s a sort of spiritual experience like others might find in religious ceremonies I don’t have a link to a source, but porcelina also put the info on this thread and I’ve read it several times so far that new album will be SD/MCIS-like…woohooooooooo!!   Have a relaxing eve evryone and may the chemical pumpkin force be with you... |
| Caution! Toxic! Shotgun Sinner  Age: 32 Gender: Female Posts: 9672 | Apparently they're going to Reading/Leeds this year. I'm so getting tickets this year  |
| bound and gagged Bulletproof Heart  Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 28660 | |
| silverrain Thinking Happy Thoughts Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 453 | ^^^^ LOL So good luck with your paper! Guess it'll help your uninformed teacher to increase knoweldge a bit."07.07.07" Do you think Billy is a little bit superstitious choosing this date?! |
| bound and gagged Bulletproof Heart Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 28660 | silverrain:I'll post it on here when I get a chance Have ya'll proof-read it |
| silverrain Thinking Happy Thoughts Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 453 | ^^^ hey sounds cool  |
| mccrack. Salute You in Your Grave Age: 36 Gender: Female Posts: 3660 | The podcast I was talking about. It's nothing big at all, Gerard just goes through a ist of people who have told him like the band and he says Billy's name. This also isn't important, but it made my little fangirl heart happy: At the recent shows here in Australia, in the "warm-up" music they played before MCR came on stage, they played Zero twice, and Today just before they came on stage every night x] And on the January 29th show, Mikey wore this:  Except that's not his shirt. One of the girls in line was wearing it, Mikey saw it, and asked her to trade shirts with him. Then the rest of my day was spent moping about how I should have worn my Zero shirt, haha. I just think it's cute he literally gave away the shirt off his back just so he could wear a Pumpkins one xD PS: No more of this "uncle jiggy" stuff, my name's Maria, my dear Pumpkinites Edit: Here's some more pointlessness from me - I just found out that the Pumpkins might be playing the Big Day Out here next year (they played in '94 as well). I am SO excited, the first thing I did was come into this thread to post xD |
| silverrain Thinking Happy Thoughts Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 453 | ^^ Hey Maria (hehe…I just got used to old uncle jiggy) - I'm Stef, by the way. Thank you so much for that podcast! You’re a sweetheart  It’s okay that Gerard doesn’t go on and on about Billy XD, but now we know for sure that he must have told them he liked what they do (he shouldn’t have dared saying something else, should he?). And it’s a cool interview on the whole. I didn’t know that all those hip hop guys are into MCR too…like Pharell - who I think has got generally a really good sense for good-quality music. But hey Mikey is the coolest that he’s changed his shirt with this girl’s Zero shirt (I guess it made both of them happy XD ) And lil' Mikey looks really handsome in that pic!Next time you know what to wear, Maria And I’ll cross my fingers that the pumpkins will confirm playing at the Big Day Out - as a compensation PS I like your new signature |
| porcelinajune Bleeding on the Floor Age: 42 Gender: Female Posts: 1278 | Hello my lovely pumpkinheads! I hope this following post makes sense cause I am tired from working all day and having a huge hangover (Yes, at 27, I should KNOW better LOL) and I feel like my head is in some other dimension lol . . .anyways. Tim Burton: Please do . . I would to read/proof it and I am sure everybody else would love to help out as well. uncle jiggy: Beyond awesome! Atleast we got one song right when we were trying to quess if they would ever cover a SP song . . . .i wished someone had some audio or vid of this. Mikey Wearing Zero I saw another pic of Mikey wearing the Zero shirt and was like  He does like quite handsome in that pic. It is still so wierd to me to think of that shirt has sort of "vintage" and to see them my new fav band wearing a shirt from my all-time fav band. Maria that's such cool details! LOL I know I would have probably been wishing I would have worn a pumpkins shirt too . See this is why I love this band . . . . silverrain: Girl, I swear you said something very similar to what my friend said. I get from the basic sense of it that it can be used in terms of a sort of revolution of sorts . I thind it really interesting title . . . .this one word can be taken to seen as represenation/commentary of what billy feels about SP and the new album and also maybe even the state of the world or the state of music. Seems like Billy maybe thinks this is what he/the band was destined for??? Or maybe he feels the is a cultural zeitgeist happening right now? I don't know. The pumpkins really weren't about making political statements . . . .statements/revolt against of the condition of the music business yes. Their message seemed to be much more on a personal/human level (does that make sense  ) so I imagine it will have more do with spirituality since that is where Machina/Zwan/Billy's solo stuff was headed. I am curious as to what the cover art is going to be injunction with this title . . .what I am SAYING . . .I CURIOUS about what the music is going to be like injunction with this title  I am not sure what the pumpkin queen thought the title would be but she just said it was obvious and that there was some political implications in all this. Also remember the flag?  I am sure that has to fit in the title someway! Maybe I am wrong maybe this is a political statement but I still don't know. silverrain: LOL kind of fits in with the whole hype of the 2007 at the end of Pisces. I was hoping something cool would happen on this date. I think he is maybe is just playing into the hype or hell for all I know he coulc have planned this from the beginning   Well atleast Billy and company keep my life interesting LOL Ya know how when you learn a new word or a particular word is brought to your attention that you start seeing it everywhere. That is what is happening with Zeitgeist. Thusday when I was processing Interlibrary Loan Requests in the database I kept seeing things like Zeitgeist publishing or mentioned int he description for a book. LOL Atleast it kept the tasking exciting! silverrain: People say your teens are your most difficult years but I have to disagree or atleast in my case. I think your mid-20s are some of the most difficult emotinal/sanity wise times . . .atleast they have been for me and many I know. There is this struggle to keep the parts of yourself that you enjoyed so much when you were younger and trying to incorporate those into your more serious adult life and I think that may have been a lot of what Billy was trying to say in the early days (in addition to what you mentioned above Stef )I think you are also right Stef and saying all the members of MCR are much more stable then those that were in SP at that age. It is so hard to translate from my head to typing what I mean about the generation thing. It is kind of like that line in disenchanted "I grew up to watch all my heros sell a car on tv" I feel it is kind mixing the early 90s grunge ideal of being down to earth (i.e. the grungy non-label clothing) and being seen as just a regular person/one of the fans . . . . and playing music with your best friends was all that mattered.(although many of these people went onto become part of the celeb machine . . .Courtney Love . . . .shit I can't think of anybody else at the moment) and mixing that with true craft/showmanship/creating art as artists such as Bowie and Queen did in the 70s. Although, I am not sure what I am trying to say as this relates to the inner dynamics of the band. Let me get back to this. Your welcome of the quote silverrain! I always loved that fax he sent back. I haven't seen any more news lately. Just more hurry up and wait. Well I hope I was somewhat cohert in my posting!  silverrain: OMG . . .I LOVE it!!!! We are so totally the chemical pumpkin jedi (and yes, I am a star wars geek). Hope everyone in pumpkinland is having a great weekend! |
| silverrain Thinking Happy Thoughts Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 453 | Hey everybody (hope you could sleep off your nasty hangover with lots of sweet dreams, Mandy )porcelinajune: hummm…in my case I’ don’t really know so far which years I consider the toughest. I think the teenage years have been difficult in a different way. Like I was a very happy kid until I was about 11/12 years old and my childhood years with my brother and the kids of my neighbourhood have been one of the best time in life (that will never come back). But I started getting pretty unhappy and depressed (and this and that the pumpkins were a true source of help through this are no exaggeration) during my teenage years. I was so shy and insecure, hated school and the pecking order there from the bottom of my heart and it was an inner struggle to go there everyday, and worse I wasn’t able to see any sense in life at all anymore. Okay, I still sometimes struggle with this today, but I’m emotionally much stronger now, I don’t feel so helpless anymore and I have a deeper trust in myself. At the same time, during my early 20s, I developed a much more stable idea of who I am and who are my true friends and who never will be. That’s why on the whole I’m a much happier person right now than I’ve been ten years ago, and If I’m still getting pessimistic once in a while I’m learning to deal with it. But I think, partner-and love searching-wise especially the 20s can be hell and of more insecurities than ever (this at least what I can tell from my own scattered experiences or those I witnessed with almost all of my friends). I guess this has still not been so difficult with my parent’s generation…at least my mum says this, who is often shaking her head about. And it’s so true for me too, Mandy, what you said about the difficulties of incorporating your younger self into your adult life. One of my friends and I have talked about this very often recently. It’s like your torn between two stages of life and you belong to neither of them completely right now. I see some people of my age getting really old, settled and boring already and I’ll hope I never be that way, then I look at the teens on the street and realize I’m not really part of them anymore…”traumatic experience” that’s absolutely right! Sorry…  this was kind of off-topic actually…but comforting to know that someone else also feels that way porcelinajune: Wow  …these are good ideas. I’ve been thinking about this line too....umm...The time the growing-up refers to must be the 1980s when the 70s were gone, punk was over and a commercial hype set in and all that matters were material success and showing off. And then ultimately grunge and the alternative scene blew all the fakes and pretenders away (at least in music and at least for a couple of years). I actually see a relation between MCR and the Pumpkins in so far that the latter were never a real grunge band but, as porcelinajune said, mixed aspects of that lifestyle (being down to earth, playing authentic music) with the showmanship and the ambitions of certain artistic concepts of the 70s. Then the late 90s showed again those blown-up, superficial features and imitators as in the 80s. But since the early 00s (<-looks funny ) till today there have been again lots of young musicians who have ripped off artificiality, bringing back music to the roots and writing songs from the heart. I see MCR as part of them but at the same time, as the pumpkins did, they incorporate these rock opera elements form the 70s and forming it into their own style. So if MCR claim not to be labelled emo but to bee seen as an individual band that has mixed their own music from different influences, this reminds me of the pumpkins arguing they are no grunge band.…I know what you mean Mandy, it’s sometimes so hard to describe in words what it seems to be so clear inside your head… hehe...but I hope it makes some sense…Alright now, have a beautiful relaxing Sunday all my chemical pumpkin jedis (lol Mandy) PS What is this 2007 at the end of Pisces actually all about? I have no real clue about astrology…umm I’m a scorpio but someone told me my ascendant was pisces…does this mean something now?! |
| bound and gagged Bulletproof Heart Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 28660 | |
| silverrain Thinking Happy Thoughts Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 453 | ^^^^ Hey pumpkin-sweetie That’s really good work!! Is this for a newspaper actually or a school magazine? I’ve to say you've got a really laid-back, objective writing-style and you’re concentrating on the facts of which I’m not sure having been capable of at your age. I also like your start. You’ve exactly realized what my editor has told me as I’ve worked as a freelancer for newspaper once: That the first paragraph is the most important one in so far as you have to find an interesting phrase or a question that get readers hooked to find out more. There are also two things I didn’t know: that Billy also played all the instruments on their debut album and that he ever dated D’arcy (aah good old gossip ) Tim Burton: I think you got that right here on the whole, although to be a little bit more precise I wouldn’t say that other indie/alternative bands laughed at them, but it was more a mixture of this particular ‘being alternative’, “we’re too good to go mainstream”-attitude (as the pumpkins would have been traitors of the scene) and jealousy of their actual success. At the same time I think this success had something to do with the pumpkins’ open-mindedness towards different music styles and, although they’ve always seen their roots in the indie scene, with their ambition to reach as many as listeners as possible. This could probably be the reason why it’s so difficult to label their sound because it incorporates so many elements. What do the other pumpkinheads think of this? So keep on writing Tim Burton! Stef |
(too bad I don’t know the content anymore).Options
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