Violence against kids in subcultures

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Mindfuck Always Born a Crime Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 5614	May 26th, 2008 at 06:41pm Faye Merci: While it does suck when people get targeted for being the way they are, it's nothing new. you choose to look a certain way, you have to accept the fact that someone isn't going to like it. Think about it. This kind of thing has been happening for ages. Some examples of people who fought just because of what they liked and how they dressed: The HJ and Swing Kids Mods and Rockers Socs and Greasers Zoots and Sailors Emos and "Jocks" It's just something natural, I'm afraid. The only thing you can do is let that kind of ignorance stay out of your mind, and try to accept people no matter how they dress or what they look like, but for who they are. *as a disclaimer, since I'm probably going to get attacked, I don't condone violence towards anyone, especially not for something as stupid as "looking emo". That kind of thing seems to me to be utterly ignorant and immoral. The point I'm trying to state is that this is a pretty human thing to do. As soon as you get two people together, they're going to notice their differences. It's human nature. So, while beating people may seem wrong, it is a human thing. We tend to be scared of what we don't know, as a survival thing. Back when we were cavemen, this probably worked out fine. However, in today's society, prejudice has no place. What we need to realize is that it won't ever go away, and that we're not going to be able to live in a world where everyone gets along and loves each other. It's not human. What we can do is try our hardest to be kind and accepting. I think the only thing you can do about this sort of thing is educate others and try to stop ignorance. The more people you get to understand the concept of "different does not equal bad", the more you're helping this world. My honest opinion, anyways. ' There's a big difference between stereotyping and bashing. Bashing is taking it one step further, or even a few steps further. It's obvious that labeling and stereotyping is human nature, but that's not really what we're talking about here. We're talking about violence, not just someone being called "emo" by a "jock".
AAAU Joining The Black Parade Age: 33 Gender: Female Posts: 234	May 26th, 2008 at 11:22pm Especially since the recent events regarding the protest, it scares me how ignorant and hateful people can be. Violence against kids in subcultures scares me, because it is the epitome of being closeminded, stubborn, stupid, and hateful, some of the worst qualities any human being can posess. Instead of being inspired by differences of kids, or adults, that are different, people often react in fear and act in hate and violence. These seem more like animal instincts rather than human nature. But perhaps we do have some animal instincts, and hate for people that are different is an example of that. We, as humans, definitely need to try hard to get over these feelings of being afraid of differences, but there is no way violence should ever be used. These pre-neanderthal actions make me worry about the human race.
Faye Merci Salute You in Your Grave Age: - Gender: - Posts: 4473	May 28th, 2008 at 09:11pm techno cocaine.: There's a big difference between stereotyping and bashing. Bashing is taking it one step further, or even a few steps further. It's obvious that labeling and stereotyping is human nature, but that's not really what we're talking about here. We're talking about violence, not just someone being called "emo" by a "jock". Which is why I listed examples of typical human nature and some groups that have gotten violent, BASED ON APPEARANCE. the hj and the swing kids - the hj was the hitler jungen (youth) and the swing kids were kids influenced by swing jazz. they often beat each other in the streets and murders were common. mods and rockers - these were different people in the 60's in england. mods often rode vespas and had very clean cut styles. rockers were like rednecks, but with a more punk vibe. they often would stab each other with knives. socs and greasers - socs were clean-cut, americana teens in the 50's. they wore billy socks, kept short hair, and listened to popular music. greasers, on the other hand, kept their long hair greasy and untamed, wore ripped clothing, and enjoyed being dirty. they often got into fights in which they used their fists and broken bottles. zoots and sailors - zoots were mexican americans in america in the 1940's. they wore big baggy outfits, reminiscent of common mafia outfits today. sailors were straight off the navy boats, full of american pride. they were often racist too. they often got into fights and even sparked a historical week of riots called the zoot suit riots in which many zoots died and were beaten severely. I didn't just list them to be smart. All of the people listed did use "violence" and suffered from it, all because of how they dressed or how they looked. I was merely trying to say that this whole emo / whoever thing is only another addition in the long line of "stereotype bashing". As far as violence based on appearance goes, emos haven't even felt past the tip of the iceberg. The groups I listed above all delt with much, much worse.
Mindfuck Always Born a Crime Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 5614	May 28th, 2008 at 09:28pm ^I'm not ignorant; I am aware that violence against subcultures is not a new thing. And while I see the point you are trying to make, I can't help but feel that the tone of it is rather apathetic. By saying subcultures today are "just another addition" to the list is true; but that doesn't mean we have to necessarily accept it and just shrug it off. If you revert back to the example given on the previous page, a young goth woman was murdered because of the fact she was goth. Now, I know that's not new, but is it just something to shrug off and go "it's just another addition"? I don't think it should be treated any lightly just because it may have happened in the past. To me, it sounds as if you think it's natural to bash people for what they look like. I personally don't think that is true. I agree stereotyping is natural, but I don't agree that stereotyping and then bashing on the basis of that stereotyping natural. I apologise if you feel I am misconstruing what you're saying, but that is just how the tone of your argument seems to be to me. Of course more subcultures in the past have felt it more than emos. I only used them as an example because that subculture seems to come up a lot.
Faye Merci Salute You in Your Grave Age: - Gender: - Posts: 4473	May 28th, 2008 at 10:21pm I'm not exactly apathetic, but I'm not exactly all torn up. I'm of the point of view that while it is horrible, I don't see why it's surprising so many people. idk. I wouldn't say I think it's natural to "bash" people, but I think it's common enough that it's not un-natural either. It's a region of gray, to me.
Mindfuck Always Born a Crime Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 5614	May 29th, 2008 at 06:23am ^I personally don't find it surprising either. I hear of people being assaulted everyday on the news and in the newspaper. But I don't feel it's something we can afford to be nonchalant about as a society. But I understand where you are coming from.
IceHog69 Bulletproof Heart Age: 31 Gender: - Posts: 25232	May 30th, 2008 at 01:02pm MigRacer: yeah. no hate crimes usually arnt just about the way they look thats just superficial but if everyone looked the same, then hate crimes would pretty much disappear, because you wouldn't be able to see that they were different. If everyone were as white as paper, had white hair, white eyes, all body features where the same, voices, everything, then people in the street wouldn't be able to tell if you were Mexican, or Jewish, or Islamic, or African, so you wouldn't get attacked, because you wouldn't look different. Hate Crimes are to do with how you look, because that is how you are identified. (I picked white, because it's like a plain canvas, that you could add bits too, like a sheet of paper. It's as blank as you can get) What if someone is beaten up because they are Jewish. They are an Orthodox Jew, so they have a beard, a hat, you know. They look Jewish. Now, they know that if they go out looking like that they will get beaten up. Yet they still chose to do it. Do you still think they should have to shave the beard, take off the hat, so that they look the same as everyone else? They have chosen to be religious. So what if their family is religious. You don't have to do the same thing. Your parents rob a bank, doesn't mean you have to. techno cocaine.: A hate crime, also known as a bias crime, is a criminal offense committed against a person, property, or society that is motivated, in whole or in part, by the offender’s bias against a race, religion, disability, sexual orientation, or ethnicity/national origin. I think that hate crime should include 'criminal offenses' that are definitely motivated by a hate of some part of the victim. If the attacker specifically says or has previously expressed severe hatred to a feature that the victim has, then it should count. Not in sense of 'i hate people looking at me like that', and then beating someone around the head because they looked at you like 'that', but more along the lines of 'Let's kill them, because they're moshers/chavs/from the wrong gang/etc'. I that is a hate crime, it is a crime committed because of hate.
Mindfuck Always Born a Crime Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 5614	May 31st, 2008 at 02:06am ^But I don't think that's correct legally. Sure, theoretically and literally a hate crime should be a crime that is committed because of hate, but legally a hate crime is not just about the superficial exterior. That's what I'm trying to say, and I think that's also what MigRacer is trying to say as well (although I can't be sure - correct me if I'm wrong). I'm not trying to say that it's any less of a crime, but legally I think a hate crime is different to what we are talking about here.
fun ghoul In a Bullet's Embrace Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 58705	May 31st, 2008 at 09:01am That's very dissapointing. Beating up kids for the subculture they choose to be in is a hate crime. -sigh- Why don't people just mind their own business?
IceHog69 Bulletproof Heart Age: 31 Gender: - Posts: 25232	May 31st, 2008 at 01:04pm techno cocaine, I know that legally it isn't a hate crime, but in my opinion, it should be classed as one. Legally hate crimes aren't supposed to be based in the superficial exterior, but they kind of are, as I explained previously, if everyone looked the same, then there would be little racism, etc etc.
thank fsm. In The Murder Scene Age: 36 Gender: Female Posts: 20564	May 31st, 2008 at 02:13pm I would just like to be annoying and point out that since these subcultures are not races, racism would be quite impossible. The word you are looking for is "prejudice," and the answer is most definitely a resounding yes. :[ I just had this thought: Does the way people treat the "emo" subculture ever make you (the ones shoved under that label) feel even more independent, stronger, and/or more likely to seek out others in your situation and bond with them? Would you call that a positive effect? Not that it outweighs the negative; just a thought.
Thug Life. Bleeding on the Floor Age: 33 Gender: Male Posts: 1315	June 7th, 2008 at 10:29am ChipmunkOnKetamine: MigRacer: yeah. no hate crimes usually arnt just about the way they look thats just superficial but if everyone looked the same, then hate crimes would pretty much disappear, because you wouldn't be able to see that they were different. If everyone were as white as paper, had white hair, white eyes, all body features where the same, voices, everything, then people in the street wouldn't be able to tell if you were Mexican, or Jewish, or Islamic, or African, so you wouldn't get attacked, because you wouldn't look different. Hate Crimes are to do with how you look, because that is how you are identified. (I picked white, because it's like a plain canvas, that you could add bits too, like a sheet of paper. It's as blank as you can get) What if someone is beaten up because they are Jewish. They are an Orthodox Jew, so they have a beard, a hat, you know. They look Jewish. Now, they know that if they go out looking like that they will get beaten up. Yet they still chose to do it. Do you still think they should have to shave the beard, take off the hat, so that they look the same as everyone else? They have chosen to be religious. So what if their family is religious. You don't have to do the same thing. Your parents rob a bank, doesn't mean you have to. . you cant compare being a Jew to say being an emo. thats just unbalanced. ones a religion thats been discriminated for at least a millennia. and emos just a fad. the emo trend will pass as sure as the sun goes down, and that Jewish man will still be dressing like that and his decedents will too.
Mindfuck Always Born a Crime Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 5614	June 7th, 2008 at 10:41am ChipmunkOnKetamine: Legally hate crimes aren't supposed to be based in the superficial exterior, but they kind of are, as I explained previously, if everyone looked the same, then there would be little racism, etc etc. That doesn't really make sense. Because someone who is a Catholic might be vilified for being Catholic (which is a hate crime) - not for what they look like. If we all looked the same, we would still be split into religious groups. And religion is a motive for a hate crime. That is what I mean when I say they are not purely based on superficial exterior. You can be a Catholic / Islamic / Jewish / a Satanist etc. and look however you want. Similarly for sexuality. You can be gay / lesbian / bi / asexual etc. and no one may ever know just by looking at you. But if someone vilifies you for being homosexual, for example, then it is a hate crime based on something that goes deeper than just their skin, hair and physical body. So if everyone looked the same, I guarantee you there will still be hate crimes. There may not be racism as such, but still hate crimes.
Way1203 Fabulous Killjoy Age: 31 Gender: Female Posts: 125	June 29th, 2008 at 11:53am I think it's sad that it is 2008 and we still cannot accept the fact that we are all different and that it's okay to be who you are (race, religion, subculture, or otherwise). We're all kids and even though may speak in different languages and dress differently, we all look the same on the inside and we all bleed red. So I honestly don't understand why some people think it's okay to harm another human being because of how they look or dress or act. It's ridiculous. And what makes it even more ridiculous is the fact that as soon as we stop calling it 'emo' and start calling it something else like 'diffs' or something, there's still going to be prejudice against people who are 'diffs'. It's a vicious cycle. It's really upsetting to know that I could be beaten up becuase I'm wearing a shirt that says "The Used" or "A7X" or "My Chemical Romance". It's really upsetting to know that I could be beaten up because of my black and red hair. It's really upsetting to know that one of my friends could be hurt because of the way they dress. All because someone was judgemental and prejudice. It's sad, it's really really sad
Spirited Away Joining The Black Parade Age: 31 Gender: Female Posts: 200	July 1st, 2008 at 01:03am I think that this is terrible. Why are people who are different always picked on? Yet, what is normal if everyone is different? It's not fair that this is happening. I guess that emos are most picked on because they dont really fight back im guessing. A jock would fight back. A punk might fight back. A cheerleader would probably try to fight back. If someone doesnt like the way you think and they way that you are, they probably won't like the person that you are without trying to get to know you. It's part of the human nature.
Momosama Killjoy Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 8	July 1st, 2008 at 07:21pm This is just sad okay. I am a victim of emo bashing, I am not emo. People think that I am emo because I wear black and listen to MCR (which does not make me emo.) It's really mostly just verbal attacks. It doesn't bother me, but it's just sad that no one can be themselves anymore.
Go fuck yourself Devil's Got Your Number Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 37823	July 2nd, 2008 at 06:00pm AAAU: Especially since the recent events regarding the protest, it scares me how ignorant and hateful people can be. Violence against kids in subcultures scares me, because it is the epitome of being closeminded, stubborn, stupid, and hateful, some of the worst qualities any human being can posess. Instead of being inspired by differences of kids, or adults, that are different, people often react in fear and act in hate and violence. These seem more like animal instincts rather than human nature. But perhaps we do have some animal instincts, and hate for people that are different is an example of that. We, as humans, definitely need to try hard to get over these feelings of being afraid of differences, but there is no way violence should ever be used. These pre-neanderthal actions make me worry about the human race. I couldn't agree more, but I do have to say, we all want to be different, no one I know wants to be your typical person, everyone says, "guess I"m just strange like that" SO what really dofference does it make, its stupid. but I gueess birds of a feather flock together
jared leto. Awake and Unafraid Age: - Gender: Female Posts: 12568	July 2nd, 2008 at 07:01pm Seriously. Why cant they just let us be? I dont get whats so wrong about the "emo" subculture. Like seriously, what did we EVER do to you. I noticed it was starting my in myschool with verbal abuse And now its starting to go to physical abuse The other day at school a boy slapped me because I was standing up for myself. Its horrible really.
drink ourselves dry. Crash Queen Age: 30 Gender: Female Posts: 34353	November 14th, 2008 at 01:20am i really hope i dont offend anyone with this comment, but what the hey. by people calling themselves 'emo' they are already going to get picked on. why sterotype yourslef? people complain that others call them emo, while at first, they have given themselves that name. it is so immature and idiotic tbh. people have no reason to label themselves and then complain.
Kaede Bleeding on the Floor Age: 33 Gender: Female Posts: 1359	November 14th, 2008 at 01:41am "Prejudice is man's gravest threat to man - the maximum of hatred for a minimum of reason."

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