Illegal Downloading

conor oberst:

I like that attitude. Not everyone will have it, of course, but I think it's commendable.

I agree. It shows that they care more about their fans liking their music than the money they're making from it. If a musician was to say that they hate (I know, a bit extreme, but it's an example) the fans that download their music illegally, to me that would scream "greedy".

Musicians have a job just like everyone else. They just happen to get paid better. When you download illegally, you are stealing from them.

Think about authors. Steven King is loaded; man's had a huge career with books and film. So would it then be okay to download a copy of his book for free? Of course not. He puts months of work into the book, and asks you to pay around $25 for a copy of his work (assuming you buy it on release day in hardcover, and then he has to pay a cut to the bookstore, the printer, his editor, his agent, his publicist, his publisher, etc.) -- I don't think that's asking too much.

When a band is making an album, that's their time and talents being used to make something for you to enjoy. When you take it from them instead of paying for it, you are showing that their time and talents are irrelevant. It's stealing -- because musicians, like authors, have to pay out to handlers, agents, techs, publicists, so on. On a tour they have to pay drivers, security, roadies, set up/breakdown, venue fees, publicists, the list goes on and on. You pay $15 for a CD and the band gets maybe $1 of that after paying out everyone else, concert tickets maybe $10 - $15 goes to them, even merch requires contracts and payouts so they don't get the full $20 you put out for a tee-shirt. For a musician to say that they don't like people downloading their music, it doesn't say greedy, it simply says that they expect to get paid their fair share for the work that they performed, just like anyone else when they go to their job.

People seem to think that because they play music, they take their career less seriously than for example, a store owner.

People here say that they don't have x amount of money to buy a CD everytime they like a song. Well, then just download one song from Itunes, not the whole CD.

Also, you wouldn't steal a packet of sweets from a store, because you wanted to try them and see if you liked them, the same should apply for bands. There are ways to try them out first. most bands have a website, or a myspace, with samples of their music on.

I don't think illegal downloading is problem because it won't really hurt the artists, first of all because not everybody downloads illegally. There will always be faithful fans who will go out and buy every cd their fave band has (thats how it is with mcr for me, even though I download most of the music I have.) Also, merchndise and concert tickets are where most of their profits are coming from. As long there aren't people who download every single song out of the thousands they may have on their ipod, and never buy tickets or anything like that then its not a problem. But if someone were to do something like that, that is not ok.

Dowloading music for free is honestly a good thing for finding new bands, because it doesn't matter if turns out to be crap or not, you haven't wasted any money. Then if you like the band or want more than a fewe of their songs, thats when you should actually buy some.

And I also agree with the idea that if you can afford it, then buy it. I dont have enough money to go buy a cd every time I like a song, and my parents wouldn't pay for it either. But if you can afford it then theres no excuse for illegal downloading.

So, if you went to the grocery store, and you only had $5, should you be allowed to get $20 worth of groceries? Should the grocery store have to lose $15 because you wanted something but didn't have enough money to pay for it?

Getting free downloads from a new band is a big difference from getting illegal downloads.

I don't think it's a huge deal. Bands aren't going to lose a huge amount of money from downloads. Also, it might gain them several fans that download their songs illegally. Also, I've seen a band three times live, and I originally bought their music illegally downloading. They gained much more money from the tickets than they would have from me buying their album. Bands will always have devoted fans and we're not going to make them go hungry.

But it's not just a song or two, it's millions of people downloading millions of songs.

Also, it's not just the bands you are affecting. Who else gets money from the selling of CDs? Music stores, Producers, managers, the record company ect.

They lose out on money too, because people insist on stealing.

And really, it is the same. You wouldn't steal the CD, but you are happy to steal the songs, provided there is no solid material being taken, just bytes of information.

Ok, 1st of all, stealing an actual cd is different from just illegally downloading them. When you steal a cd, you are stealing from the musician, the record company, the store, whoever shipped it to the store, whoever made the cd and the case, etc. When you download it, only the musician and the record company are getting ripped off, and I don't see that as a problem because 1) The musician really doesn't get that much profit from the cd itself 2) A lot of record companies are huge corrupt corporations and again not all their profits come from how many records are sold 3) Many musicians have said they don't care if people download illegally, its about reaching as many people as possible.

As for the grocery store analogy that someone brought up, that is completely irrelevant. When you steal food, you can't contribute to that same food company by buying its merch or concert tickets can you? Well you can with music. And also, I would like to remind you that I don't think illegally downloading every single song is right and never contributing anything to the music business. If you download something illegally, you can always go back later and buy it. If you stole food, you could go back later and buy it, but you would already have eaten the other food so the store was still getting ripped off. With music if you go back later and buy it no one is getting ripped off.

Another thing that a lot of people have overlooked on here is burning CDs. Please don't try and say you don't own a single burned CD, because that is highly unlikely. No one really questions whether burning CDs is right, yet they attack illegal downloading. Its the same thing, they are both illegal ways to get free music.

mcrfreak256:

The musician really doesn't get that much profit from the cd itself

Not if one person did it. But we all know that there's more than one person in the world downloading music illegaly

mcrfreak256:

2) A lot of record companies are huge corrupt corporations and again not all their profits come from how many records are sold

The whole "record companies are corrupt" thing is your opinion. That doesn't mean it's necessarily true.

mcrfreak256:

3) Many musicians have said they don't care if people download illegally, its about reaching as many people as possible.

Last time I checked, 'many' was not synonymous with 'all'.
There are musicians who don't care, but there are musicians that do. It's a tad illogical to make sweeping generalisations about all musicians.

mcrfreak256:

When you steal food, you can't contribute to that same food company by buying its merch or concert tickets can you? Well you can with music.

I would suggest that if you have enough money to go to concerts and buy merch, then you have enough money to buy music . Merch and tickets are usually quite expensive in comparison to the music.

Mindfuck:

I would suggest that if you have enough money to go to concerts and buy merch, then you have enough money to buy music .

Not necesarily. Maybe you would really like to go to a bands concert at some point and can afford the tickets, when you downloaded the music at a time when you really couldn't afford to buy the music. Also, not all merchandise is expensive, like band tees. Maybe you only have enough money to buy either 20 songs from an artist or a $20 t-shirt. If you chose the t-shirt you would still be contributing to the band, and maybe even more of the profits would go to them than if you had legally downloaded those 20 songs.

Another point that I forgot to bring up was that illegal downloding can actually help bands in some way. The best example of that would be that when I first listened to MCR, I limewired about half of the songs from TBP, and then eventually the rest of it. After a while I really liked it and I gained a lot of respect for those guys, so I felt bad about not buying it so I went out and spent $50 on their CDs, including TBP even though I already had those songs illegally, when I easily could have just limewired everything and never payed a dime. If a band is good enough, people are going to want to contribute to it like I did there. So basically what I'm saying is that illegal downloading is a good way to get into music, and then if its good stuff you can always go buy it later when you know you won't be wasting your money.

karyu.:

you know, i don't think any band would be as popular as they are without downloading. when you see or hear about a band, in most cases, you're not going to dash to the music store to buy their album. no, you're gonna download it and see if you like it or not, and only then perhaps buy the actual CD.
.

There are other ways to try a band out, with out breaking the law.

Simple and Clean:

But it's not just a song or two, it's millions of people downloading millions of songs.

Also, it's not just the bands you are affecting. Who else gets money from the selling of CDs? Music stores, Producers, managers, the record company ect.

They lose out on money too, because people insist on stealing.

And really, it is the same. You wouldn't steal the CD, but you are happy to steal the songs, provided there is no solid material being taken, just bytes of information.

And I'm sure despite those millions of songs, the artists still have an assload of money. Artists don't get much money from CDs in the first place, and really? Record companies? They're hurting? The record execs make more money then the band does! CDs aren't cheap.

Simple and Clean:

There are other ways to try a band out, with out breaking the law.

Like what? I know I won't go out and buy a CD that I'm not sure I'll like. A few possible ways:

youtube - uh, that's considered illegal too. you're putting up copyrighted things on a site where you're not supposed to put them up on. plus you can DL off youtube too.
myspace - rarely has full albums.
any other music site - same thing

and face it, listening to albums online on music sites just isn't the same as blaring it through speakers or on the go on a mp3/iPod/phone.

not everyone has enough money to waste on CDs they don't like in the end. In fact, the RIAA says you can preview DL'd music for 24 hours (even though some are kept for a long time) legally and then delete it. We're not all rich people who like spending their money on CDs. If an artist just wants money and that's the only reason why they make CDs, then that's greedy and not what music should be for, and those artists are most likely in the millions now.

There's a difference between stealing a CD and illegally downloading music. While I'm not saying that either is right, if you steal a CD, the CD isn't at the store anymore, the people/companies involved with the production/distribution of it lose whatever amount it cost make the physical CD. But theoretically, you could make as many copies/download an album many, many times, and the artist would not lose any money except in possible lost sales.