Prostitution

drain all the blood:

I'm all against prostitution. Even though it is illegal in places, people still do it. So imagine if it was legalized. Even more people would do it and there would be even more people with STDs and AIDS. I think it is unsafe and wrong on so many different levels.

i don't think you understand the purpose of a condom.

Diana_a7x:

I'm against it, it should not be legal, we have more than enough people with the HIV virus.

again ever heard of condoms?

and HIV can be passed through blood so there are other ways of getting it other then sex.
and countries in Africa are mostly Catholic and disagree with contraception; that's how they get AIDS

Resurrecting an old Topic, but just following the Rules in doing so.

Having read through part of the thread, although not all of it, I feel that there have been a number of generalisations expressed, and I, as someone who used to be a Prostitute, thought that maybe I can bring a different perspective to this Debate.

I'm not quite sure how or where to start though, as I used to be someone who was fiercely anti-prostitution, and when the issue of legalising it was being debated in Parliament here in New Zealand, I was one of the voices saying "No" to that particular Bill. Having said that, my reasons for being so anti were personal, because my now ex-husband had cheated on me by going to visit a prostitute at one of the Parlours (we don't call them brothels here so much). And it hurt, it hurt me deeply, and before going any further I would just ask that no one say something like "well, he must have gone to see a prostitute because you weren't giving him any, or there was something else missing in your relationship" - please. Because my situation was not like that at all. My Ex and I had a very healthy sex relationship, but it was an abusive one, in which I was abused mentally, emotionally, physically, and spiritually. His reasons for going to a prostitute had nothing to do with anything lacking in our relationship, and more to do with him being the kind of man that he was. He did it to hurt me, end of story.

Move forward, a few years later, to a time when I had left the home my ex and I shared, after he cracked my ribs, and moved into a place of my own so that I could be safe whilst we tried to work on our marriage. He needed proper help, and told me that he was going to get it. But, yet again, because I didn't do what he wanted me to do (move back in with him straight away), he decided to have sex with a woman that he worked with, and one he knew fancied him. Our relationship at that time wasn't over, as far as I knew, and even when I found out about it, I stupidly forgave him again. But, it didn't stop there. He continued to see her, and eventually moved in with her, and I being the fool that I was, still had a relationship with him. She didn't know that he and I were still kind of together, and so I was in effect the other woman to my own husband.

After spending 16 yrs in an abusive and controlling marriage, I felt totally powerless against him. If he showed up at my door, wanting to spend time with me, have sex with me, whatever, I couldn't find it in myself to say no. But every time he walked out my door, out of my bed (our marital bed), and went back to her, it was hurting me. Eventually, it got too much for me, but I still couldn't say no to him. So I tried to think of a different way to stop it. Initially, I thought of sleeping with another man, as I knew that he wouldn't come back knocking on my door if I was ever unfaithful to him. But that was something else I couldn't bring myself to do - the only man I desired was my then-husband. And for me to go out and meet another man, and then sleep with him, desire would need to be there. So, I instead decided to become a Prostitute, for at least that way, no personal feelings from me would need to be involved. It would just be a persona that I created that would be having sex for money. After about a month of prostituting, I told my husband that I had been doing it, and sure enough, it worked. In less than a week he and his girlfriend quietly left town.

Even so, I still continued to work in the industry for about 18 months or so, and whilst I initially worked in Parlours, which did in fact have emergency call buttons etc. for security, the Parlour Owners made it difficult for the working girls, expecting way too much from them, and blatantly taking advantage of the girls, even though it was legal in New Zealand by then. Basically, they were going against the laws that had been created to protect the prostitutes, and the girls felt powerless to fight them. If you did, you'd just be fired. Simple.

So, I decided to work privately from home, using the local Newspaper as my source of Clientèle. This gave me more control over when I worked, and who I would work with. Surprisingly, the quality of clients when working from home were far better than those you would get working in the Parlours.

I am no longer working in the Sex Industry, and haven't been for some time, but as my time is limited at the moment, I will leave it at that for now. I will be back later on to discuss a number of issues and observances made by myself during my time in the industry, as well as attempt to express my opinion on whether or not it should be legalised.

I think that prostitution should be legalized, because then it would become more like an escort service, only with extras. Most escort services aren't supposed to offer sex, but simply 'an escort' to take you to a party or a wedding, or where ever. Legalizing prostitution could mean that brothels are set up, where clients have to go on a register, and if they are on there, they must be sti free. If they contract one, it is their legal obligation to report it. They can't go to other places for sex, they have to stay in the prostitutes room, where they can be monitored, and the lady (as it usually is) has the right to defend her self if the client gets aggressive. I think it would take women off the streets, and put them in a safer environment, where they could earn money, but in a safer manner.

I'm not sure what I think of prostitution really. I don't think it's right, but I'm not against it. I think it's sad to think that women are doing that to themselves (and some med) but I agree that it can be a last resort, or can be something they have to do.

ChipmunkOnKetamine, I agree with what you say somewhat though. If prostitution was legalised, it would make it much safer for the prostitutes and for the clients.
Although, I don't know that I agree too much with brothels and orgy's. I think it should be kept to just one-on-one.

^ I didn't mention orgys. I'm sorry if it came across like that.

ChipmunkOnKetamine:

I think taht prostitution should be legalized, because then it would become more like an escort service, only with extras. Most escort services aren't supposed to offer sex, but simply 'an escort' to take you to a party or a wedding, or where ever. Legalizing prostitution could mean that brothels are set up, where clients have to go on a regester, and if they are on there, they must be sti free. If they contract one, it is their legal obligation to report it. They can't go to other places for sex, they have to stay in the prostitutes room, where they can be monitered, and the lady (as it usually is) has the right to defend her self if the client gets aggressive. I think it would take women off the streets, and put them in a safer environment, where they could earn money, but in a safer manner.

Some prostitutes like working 'for themselves' though.

I have personally considered going into the sex industry, not out of desperation, but purely because I am interested in it. And I would much rather work for myself from my house rather than be in a brothel where someone is 'in charge' of me. I agree with what you're saying about 'getting women off the streets', because if you walk the streets looking for business, particularly at night, then it can be dangerous. But I think if it were to be legalised, then I don't think brothels should be the only option for women wanting to work in the sex industry. Because as Tivka stated in her personal story, not all brothels are ideal.

And I also agree with the register type thing, because in theory it would help with regulating STI's and such.

^ maybe some sort of union that can keep track of things. So you can work from home, and how you want, but at the same time, there is somthing there to protect you.

I feel rather conflicted about prostitution. Obviously, as it exists now, it's a really ugly situation, one that is rank with abuse. I feel that legalizing it might do something to help the situation, because at least then help would be available.

Ideally, if prostitution were legalized, it would then be possible to ensure that underage girls were not forced into it, and to also ensure that human trafficking ceased. Ideally, it would be possible for a woman to chose this as another career option, since it is her body, and one would hope that legalization would make women safer in this line of work. (Though it's not one I'd chose for myself.)

However, I don't know that this is possible. So for me, the jury's out.

Oh, and ChipmunkOnKetamine -- I believe Holland does have a sex workers' union. But I don't know for sure.

Trafficking is a burning issue. We need to deal with it. How we can deal with humans being sold into slavery is decided by what laws we have around prostitution. I don't care what our laws say about prostitution, as long as we can use those laws fighting modern slavery.

We have a growing problem in norway and sweden. Women from the ivory coast and surrounding areas come here for 3 months at a time only to prostitute themselfs. Its a ticking timebomb since such a high percentage of them have HIV.
Thats just one of thousand aspects that needs to be taken into considderation when it comes to creating laws around such a thing. I'm not sure I'm qualified to even have an opinion on the laws there.
However, I see nothing wrong in working within the sexindustry. But if it was my kids it was about, then I would wish for them to be happy. It would take some convincing for me. Call it prejudice but I don't think its an industry that makes you happy.

i think it should be illegal because it is sick. sleeping with men who probably don't have a life. its disgusting that there's even such thing as prostitution. and the people that do it get money for doing it.

Okay, continuing from my post above ~ apologies for the length of time it has taken for me to get back to it.

I think that when discussing this issue, one needs to realise and take into account the different 'types' of Prostitution. You have the street prostitutes, the parlour prostitutes, the private prostitutes, and the ones who are forced into it. This can create a problem whereby legislation directly relating to Prostitution as a whole can be difficult. If it is legalised, do we legalise all forms of it? Or just some? Naturally I am not referring to forced prostitution when I say that ~ such a thing is wrong, regardless of the legality of prostitution.

During my time as a Sex Work, I felt such incredible sadness for the young ones. There were girls at the Parlours that had been prostituting themselves since they were 14, 15 yrs of age. Because of the legislation in New Zealand, they had to be 18 or over to work in Prostitution, as did the Clients. That being said, not once, in any of the parlours I worked in, did I ever see any new Sex Worker or Client being asked for proof of their age. But really, is an 18 yr old truly mature enough to make the decision to be a Sex Worker? A decision that may affect them for the rest of their lives? It was different for me, as I was over 40 when I decided to work in the industry, but I know damn well I would not have been mature enough at 18 to make such an important decision.

One of the main observances I made whilst in the industry is the fact that the majority of the Sex Workers were doing it for the money to support a drug habit of some sort, whether it be Marijuana, Benzo's, P, Heroin, or the like. And if they weren't doing it for drugs at the time, they were older women who had gotten off the drugs, but lacked the ability for some reason to get out of the industry. Oh, they tried at times, but they would always end up back there. And even though I was one myself, it seemed to be such a waste of a life. I did not meet one working girl that didn't have major issues from the past that probably impacted on the choices they have made, including myself. Many were sexually abused at a young age, had extremely low self-esteem, and felt unwanted, unloved, and rejected. And of course, prostitution only further confirmed those kind of self-beliefs. Think about it - a client walks into the parlour, and the girls all have to introduce themselves, and then wait to see who the client picks. Kind of like a meat market. And if you weren't picked, would that not reinforce your self-belief that you were unwanted?

It is issues such as these that concern me the most, not whether or not Prostitution itself is legalised, but the girls, the women, the workers themselves. Very few are what you might consider to be emotionally and mentally healthy women. Even now, as I think of some of the young girls I worked with, I feel such an incredible amount of sadness, and yearning to be able to help them somehow, but I know I can't. Only the individual themselves can do that.

In New Zealand, we don't necessarily have a Union, but we do have what is known as the Prostitutes Collective, which is more of a supportive country-wide group for Prostitutes. They offer not only advice, but also sell Condoms, Dental Dams, Lubricants, etc. at a much reduced price to ensure that the Sex Worker keeps herself safe. And believe it or not, they actually DON'T want to get diseases, and do use condoms - it is the Clients that try to pressure you into not using protection! As a general rule, although not a law, the Prostitutes I came across would get themselves checked for STI's free every 3 months. And when it comes to condom breakage, you are taught how to do your best to prevent that from happening. You are also given tips on how to work in such a way that you can ensure that the Client does not remove the Condom while he is with you. Those tips are essential, as the number of Clients that try to would surprise you ~ even those who are obviously married!

So, when I take everything into account, for me, the answer to the legislation of Prostitution is definitely NOT an easy one. I would much prefer that there be an age limit, so that only women 25 yrs and older can work in the Industry, but that would only drive the younger ones out onto the streets, and into dangerous situations. I would like to see the Parlours inspected on a regular basis, to ensure that they are clean and safe ~ many of them do not maintain very good standards in regards to cleanliness! Other ideas I would have would be that Prostitutes are licensed in some way, and that part of keeping their license they have to have regular STI checks as well as a good knowledge of keeping themselves safe sexually. And a Union that actually has some 'bite' when it comes to Parlour owners and the protection of the rights of the Sex Workers would be great. I believe that Street Prostitution should remain illegal, and that only Parlour or Private Prostitution should be legal. Where Private Prostitution is concerned, then if there was a licensing policy in place, then Newspapers would not be allowed to print any advertising for any Sex Worker without a current license. These are just a few ideas to throw out there, as someone who has actually worked in this industry.

I think it would be great, as well as courageous, if a male who had utilised the services of a Sex Worker could also post in this thread, and in doing so provide us with another aspect to the topic at hand ~ any takers out there?

Finally, I would just like to say that this issue is not a black and white one, and that there is a LOT to consider and take into account. As the laws stand in New Zealand right now, I do not believe they are sufficient in terms of protecting both the workers and the clients, but the legalising of Prostitution here is fairly new, so maybe a lot of kinks need to be worked out. Also, please don't judge the Sex Workers, or imply that they are disease-ridden because of the industry they work in ~ believe me, they don't particularly want to get STI's either!!!

MCR_lover_!:

i think it should be illegal because it is sick. sleeping with men who probably don't have a life. its disgusting that there's even such thing as prostitution. and the people that do it get money for doing it.

It would be preferable if you were capable of expressing your opinion without the use of such loaded words as 'sick' and 'disgusting'........

Hope you don't think I ment sexworkers in general with the STD, 12% of the population in the ivory coast has HIV or AIDS :/
Big thanks for posting your opinions though, it was a really interesting read!

MCR_lover_!:

i think it should be illegal because it is sick. sleeping with men who probably don't have a life. its disgusting that there's even such thing as prostitution. and the people that do it get money for doing it.

I think that is a vast misrepresentation of all people involved in prostitution. Not just the prostitute themselves, but also the clients. I think most clients have a stigma attached to them, where they are seen as being lonely, miserable men. I don't think that is the case. A while wide variety of people use the "services" of prostitutes, for want of a better term. Not just "men who don't have a life". I've even heard that some men use the services of prostitutes for things other than sex. A woman I was talking to recently who has been in the sex industry for five years said that she sometimes gets male clients who just want to have a deep and meaningful chat - because they want to talk and disclose things with someone they don't know, and who they can ask to comfort them. I know that sounds odd, but it is important to recognise the fact that some clients are not sex-crazed lonely losers. I know you didn't say that, MCR_lover, but a lot of other people think that.

And the prostitutes themselves - well, I cannot say the same for all people in the sex industry, but I have met a number of people who work in it, and I must say the women I have met are not sick or disgusting women with low moral standards, they actually respect themselves and have quite a lot of self-esteem.